D&D (2024) Warlock -- initial analyses

Kobold Stew

Last Guy in the Airlock
Supporter
Three videos have dropped in the past 2 days spilling the goods on the 2024 Warlock.
Treantmonk on Invocations
Treantmonk on the Class and Subclasses
Dungeon Dudes

Here are my major takeaways:
  • “more invocations than ever before”: technically true, but given that the pact is rolled into this, for most of an adventurer’s career, it’s fucntionally only one more than before (an extra one at 5). What is present is greater flexibility: you can choose 3 pacts or none.
    • Going pactless means you get either mage armor or eldritch mind at level 1. No other choices.
  • Pact of the Blade
    • everyone gets to be a Hexblade now, but to be effective it is very resource-heavy. You for sure want lifedrinker and thirsting blade by level 9, so that’s 3 of your 7 invocations. You might reasonably choose not to take eldritch smite.
    • Treantmonk stresses that you probably don’t want to invest in STR, and would need to spend two feats to get proficiency in shields and medium armor. That’s a huge investment, and so the player is making tough choices. A dip in Fighter solves this.
    • Dudes instead frame things in terms of the choice between STR and DEX – you need 13 STR if your pact weapon is going to be Heavy; DEX improves your AC. You probably can’t do both. Either way, you end up building around this: start with a 13 STR, take two feats incl. GWM or PAM, and these boost your STR so you can wear heavy armor (but they don’t make clear where that proficiency comes from) – but doing so slows down how long it takes to get to CHA 20. They conclude that this “feels like a bladesinger”, but it’s not a necessary way to build your character, just one way to do so.
    • Both think that a 1-level dip in Fighter (or paladin, cleric) solves a lot.
  • Pact of the Chain
    • Neither discusses this much. There are better choices than before; 2 invocation investment to get Investment of the Chain at 5.
  • Pact of the Tome
    • One invocation investment (Gift of Protectors at level 9 available but perhaps not needed).
    • Treantmonk misses the value of this: yes, rituals can only be 1st level (contra 2014), but you get to choose ANY two rituals each time the book appears. That gives more range than the ritual caster feat (but arguably a bit less flexibility, since only 2 are available at any time). In addition, you get the benefits of the Book of Ancient Secrets, so it’s functionally 2-invocations-in-1, constrained only by the general rule on rituals that they have applied globally (no one gets 3rd level rituals, without 5 levels in the relevant class)
  • Eldritch Blast
    • Two invocations needed (agonizing and repelling) to make good use of this; you probably don’t need eldritch spear.
  • Subclasses: Everybody thinks GOO is best and Celestial the worst subclass (Celestial being particularly hampered at level 6 by a lack of spells that cause radiant damage).
  • Invocations:
    • Treantmonk really likes being able to Jump at will (this is hilarious, given how weak this invocation was in 2014).
    • He also ranks being able to cast Alter Self at will really low. I think this misses the mark: Alter Self takes your concentration, but it gives something approximating three other Invocations: You can change your appearance like Mask of Many Faces (but: it’s not an illusion, which makes this better); you can swim and breathe water like Gift of the Depths (but: it affects only you and not your party); you can have natural weapons that attack using your casting stat (but: it’s only a d6). I think this is the flexibility the Warlock needs, and using Concentration is a good balancing requirement.
My thoughts seeing this:
  • The choices on Pact of the Blade invites a broader range of builds than we saw in 2014. They’re all constrained, but it could lead to a larger diversity in play.
  • For the Celestial: Radiant Soul (at 6) doesn’t add to damage of Pact of the Blade, since the blade attack isn’t a spell, but True Strike would be. This makes me think the Raidant Soul can be a blade-pact-lite, casting True Strike with a weapon, and adding +CHA twice. That’s good, but it means you’re not eligible for Extra Attack. It’s a use for Radiant Soul, though.
  • For the GOO: Awakened Mind (a “ribbon” ability says Treantmonk) becomes cool at 6 with Clairvoyant Combatant. I like the way a support ability can become offensive at a higher level. There are some redundancies with the Telepathic feat, but you might want both anyways (there are also redundancies with Telekinetic and Arcane Trickster for the Rogue)
  • For the GOO: By level 14, the overlap of Hex and Summon Aberration is effective, but that’s eating up your spell slots. I’ve not played a Warlock at this level: is this going to be an effective tactic in play?
  • For the Fiend Patron: (weird interaction) Dark One’s blessing grants a minimum of 1 THP, and this is something I think we’ve only seen in the past on abilities that build off of your casting stat – so that if you have a 10 CHA you still get one use. This is different, though, since the benefit will always be at least 2 thp, since it’s giving (level+CHA), so even with an 8 Charisma you’d get 2 thp, and most will be getting at least 6 at level 3.
 
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Kurotowa

Legend
  • For the Celestial: Radiant Soul (at 6) doesn’t add to damage of Pact of the Blade, since the blade attack isn’t a spell, but True Strike would be. This makes me think the Raidant Soul can be a blade-pact-lite, casting True Strike with a weapon, and adding +CHA twice. That’s good, but it means you’re not eligible for Extra Attack. It’s a use for Radiant Soul, though.
I've played around with the idea of a Celestial Bladelock, and it's better than that. Agonizing Blast can be applied to any Warlock cantrip now, so if you put it on True Strike (or Green-Flame Blade if your DM allows pre-Revision material) you get triple your Cha mod. Once from Blade Pact because it's an attack with your Pact Weapon, once from Agonizing Blast, and once from Radiant Soul.

The last time I checked the math it's a bit ahead of two attacks and a little behind three attacks. Well, unless you're using GFB and cleaving, that's still ahead. But that's leaving out magic weapons and other enhancements. Anything that works on a per-hit basis favors multiple attacks, and anything that's once per turn favors the single weapon cantrip attack.

It's a bit of a gimmicky setup, but in general it's roughly on par with the standard Bladelock setup. It's not an overpowered exploit or a crippled theme build.
 


Kurotowa

Legend
Cool -- and that in part explains why it's important that Agonizing Blast be attached to a single cantrip, and not globally.
Indeed. The build is especially good with GFB because while Radiant Soul is limited to once per turn, Agonizing Blast works with every damage roll. So it gets applied to both the main hit and the cleave damage of GFB. But again, I expect there's going to be different policies on mixing in pre-Revision spells, depending the DM. So I hesitate to offer it as a baseline expectation.
 

AdmundfortGeographer

Getting lost in fantasy maps
Would the Radiant Soul apply to attacks hit within a Spirit Shroud (if allowed)?

For instance Eldritch Blasting (with Spellsniper) on targets inside the shroud?

———

I would have loved if the Healer origin feat could apply to the dice rolls of Healing Light. Would have been a nice bump, and an extra incentive for a Lessons invocation pick for a Celestial.
 

Charlaquin

Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Weird to me that everyone is rating pact of the blade so highly when it takes three invocations to get the pact itself and your two extra attacks, where Eldritch Blast only requires one invocation to get the same number of attacks, dealing the same damage (unless you invest in 13 Strength to be able to use a Greatsword or Greataxe as your pact weapon, which only increases your average damage by 1 over EB with AB), with only one hand instead of two, at range. I get that the playtest pact of the blade was a bit much, but this version is just bad again.
 


Pauln6

Hero
Warlock is always the most interesting class because its the only one without the standard 5th ed flavor. There are options for your character to develop into. All other 5th ed classes get 1 choice - subclass and thats it. Warlock allows multiple options to customize your character that all other classes do not.
Rogues have a few more choices. I think fighters should get a choice of 1 out of 2 manoeuvres linked to their fighting style at higher levels or something.
 


Baumi

Adventurer
Weird to me that everyone is rating pact of the blade so highly when it takes three invocations to get the pact itself and your two extra attacks, where Eldritch Blast only requires one invocation to get the same number of attacks, dealing the same damage (unless you invest in 13 Strength to be able to use a Greatsword or Greataxe as your pact weapon, which only increases your average damage by 1 over EB with AB), with only one hand instead of two, at range. I get that the playtest pact of the blade was a bit much, but this version is just bad again.
I also think it's to costly compared to Eldritch Blast, but I think you can get nice effects with a good magic Weapon and maybe Weapon Specialisation (if you Multiclass) that you cannt with EB.

In my opionion, the main problem is that agonizing blast is used per attack, which makes it EB overshadowing all other Cantrips and therefore limiting the options.
 

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