Warlock's Curse and Hunter's Quarry - Can enemies see it?

[Leprejuan]

While it might not make sense that it can detect the quarry except as an itch between its shoulderblades or whatever, the curse might be something far more visible. A dark pall might settle over the creature and a grim cold settle through their veins as they become more vulnerable to the eldritch energy of the warlock, etc. You don't have to do damage for a creature to realize something is up.

I'm with this guy.

The ranger is drawing a bead with HQ. The goblin's head snaps around and it starts scanning the hillside. "My neck hairs are standing up." It may or may not be able to notice or do anything about it.

The warlock curses a person. The person feels the drop in the pit of their stomach as their spirit is altered. They make the sign of the evil eye and start looking around for the source.

 

[Mongo1967]

I wouldn't have the targets automatically detect the effect (which is technically against RAW, but I'm okay with that), but I would have them switch from passive to active perception checks.

Mook #1: "Hey Benny, did you hear something? I just got the chills."
Mook #2: "Dude, you're such a pansy. Would you like me to check for the Bogeyman before you wet yourself?"
Mook #1: "Listen, I tell you there's something out there. Maybe we should tell the others."
Mook #2: "And get laughed at when there's nothing there? No way, you're just jumping at shado..." [thunk as an arrow splits his chest]

 

[Stogoe]

I'm with this guy.

The ranger is drawing a bead with HQ. The goblin's head snaps around and it starts scanning the hillside. "My neck hairs are standing up." It may or may not be able to notice or do anything about it.

The warlock curses a person. The person feels the drop in the pit of their stomach as their spirit is altered. They make the sign of the evil eye and start looking around for the source.

I agree; I'd rule that the target knows something's 'not right', but not anything like "Hey guys, look at the pointy arrow over my head. Someone's cursed me from over in those bushes."

 

[Lizard]

Hmmm not convinced
I guess a counter argument to that with would be a stealthy bow Ranger trying to take out some sentries quickly and quietly with the benefit of Hunter's Quarry. Would be silly if a huge WoW-like pointy arrow appeared above the sentry's head?!
Reebo

Uhm....the rules explicitly say any target is aware of any conditions affecting it and who caused the condition. There's not much room for "convincing" there. You can houserule if you wish to, of course, but the rules as written are crystal clear.

Now, it does not follow that OTHERS know what's going on -- that depends on the "special effects". But since the person targeted DOES know, he is perfectly free to communicate this information:"Guys, I'm feeling all woozy and weak...it's coming from over there, in the woods!", or whatever.

Remember, always, that the NPCs live in the world and that (barring unusual circumstances) the powers and abilities PCs possess are not new or unique. Kobolds, orcs, etc, can have their own warlocks and rangers, and even if they don't, they've dealt with them enough times that they know what they can do and will have developed strategies and tactics to respond to it. It's like saying that if a modern soldier doesn't happen to have a grenade of his own, he won't know what it means when he sees one land next to him. He knows what it is, what it can do, and can quickly deduce that, duh, someone must have thrown it and probably guess, roughly, where it came from.

It should also be noted that the rules say "When you affect a creature with a power" and that creatures know what "conditions" you have imposed. Hunter's Quarry is NOT a power and does not impose a condition, so it might be an exception.

 

[Stalker0]

Uhm....the rules explicitly say any target is aware of any conditions affecting it and who caused the condition. There's not much room for "convincing" there. You can houserule if you wish to, of course, but the rules as written are crystal clear.

I would love a page reference on this one, I thought that passage was in the book somewhere but I can't find it.

Right now I've only seen this:

1) People know when a power has been placed on them and what it does. If a paladin marks you, you are completely aware of the pain.

2) Class abilities are not powers unless they say they are, mark and curse are not powers, just like the fighter's mark is a not a power.

3) Being marked is a condition, I haven't seen a passage that says a creature is aware of his conditions, but in my group we ruled it that way. If there is a page reference in teh book please let me know.

4) Cursed and Quarried are not conditions specified in the book in that nice list of conditions. So even if there is a clause that says you are aware of your condition, those don't apply to cursed and quarried necessarily.

 

[Lizard]

I would love a page reference on this one, I thought that passage was in the book somewhere but I can't find it.

Page 57, column 2, last paragrahp.

1) People know when a power has been placed on them and what it does. If a paladin marks you, you are completely aware of the pain.

2) Class abilities are not powers unless they say they are, mark and curse are not powers, just like the fighter's mark is a not a power.

3) Being marked is a condition, I haven't seen a passage that says a creature is aware of his conditions, but in my group we ruled it that way. If there is a page reference in teh book please let me know.

That's what it says on 57. If someone has a condition, they know what it is. Divine Challenge is listed as an explicit example. The text says "...knows what YOU'VE done to it" (emphasis mine) so it knows the source of the power.

4) Cursed and Quarried are not conditions specified in the book in that nice list of conditions. So even if there is a clause that says you are aware of your condition, those don't apply to cursed and quarried necessarily.

This may well be the case; neither are "Powers" and neither imposes a "condition". WOTC needs to issue a ruling, really.

 

[Stalker0]

Page 57, column 2, last paragrahp.

That only refers to conditions given by powers, it says nothing about class abilities unfortunately.

 

[Jhaelen]

That only refers to conditions given by powers, it says nothing about class abilities unfortunately.

Well, on p.91 under the heading 'divine challenge', it says:

You can use the divine challenge power to mark an enemy of your choice

. The section 'Class Features' on the same page starts with the sentence:

The paladin has three class features that work like powers

Warlock's Curse and Hunter's Quarry seem to be different. I assume that is because there's nothing a target can do about these (except killing the source of these abilities). Divine Challenge is different in that they can avoid any negative effect by attacking the paladin.