Warlocks...how do they play?

[lukelightning]

I have a grudge against warlocks and used to complain endlessly that they were overpowered. But then I realized it was because of a specific situation: a player in my game brought in a warlock character that totally overshadowed my thrown-weapon-rogue. This was more a feature of rogues (specifically rogues' signature ability of sneak attack) sucking than anything else.

 

[irdeggman]

My personal opinion is that nobody really understands the warlock. I base this on the fact that most people tend to claim the warlock is weak when this is far from true. A warlock has a host of interesting skills and class abilities that are worth considering but are often ignored by what I call the OMFG ELDRITCH BLAST IS UNLIMITED factor. Lots of people seem to think the crux of the class is the eldritch blast, but I beg to differ. The eldritch blast is no more the crux of the warlock than a weapon is the crux of a rogue. Sure, a rogue needs a weapon to deal sneak attack damage (which is commensurate in power to the eldritch blast), but would anyone think a rogue has absolutely nothing to do without sneak attack? Hardly. And the same is true of the warlock. Many useful abilities including:

Actually it is more like saying a soulknife isn't based on his mindblade.

Soulknives have a real similar list of class skills to the warlock and more hit points to boot.

A warlock does revolve around his eldritch blast, he has other things going for him - but his single most anchoring clas ability his is eldritch blast.

Most opinions in fact start with the warlock is overpowering and then have to have explanations given as to why the class is not overpowering.

Quite a lot of posters have stated, however, that the class does tend to get boring to play after a while due to the reliance on the eldritch blast class ability.

A warlock gets 2+ Int mod skill points per level, while a soulknife gets 4+Int mod per level. So while the warlock does get a good list of class skills he is not a skill monkey becasue he doesn't get a lot of skill points, in fact his sp generation is in the lowest bracket (2+Int mod).

I absolutely agree the class is versatile and can contribute in a lot of ways - but at its core it is still a one-trick pony.

And I don't think I hae ever seen a majority opinion on the class that it is a "weak" class.

 

[Anti-Sean]

Actually it is more like saying a soulknife isn't based on his mindblade.

Oh man, now you've got me wanting to play a Warlock/Soulknife gestalt! *drool*

 

[Sigdel]

Oh man, now you've got me wanting to play a Warlock/Soulknife gestalt! *drool*

Or go soulknife/pyrokineticist. You will eventualy get a eldrich blast like attack. It does fire damage, but still not bad. And it peaks at 10d6 sooner that EB

 

[Cabral]

If you're going to gestalt with Warlock, some great psionic powers are
Fission spawn a twin with full use of your invocations and eldritch blasts.
Schism create a sub-brain to get an extra standard action of purely mental nature (ie, manifesting powers).

Wondertwin powers, activate!

 

[I'm A Banana]

A warlock does revolve around his eldritch blast, he has other things going for him - but his single most anchoring clas ability his is eldritch blast.

True. But I would say his invocations are where the real fun lies.

Most opinions in fact start with the warlock is overpowering and then have to have explanations given as to why the class is not overpowering.

Well, most opinions are developed on an emotional reaction and not a logical analysis.

Quite a lot of posters have stated, however, that the class does tend to get boring to play after a while due to the reliance on the eldritch blast class ability.

And I've pointed out that those who focus on the edritch blast are ignoring some of the most fun aspects of the warlock, so it's not the fault of the class that they got bored, but the fault of making the warlock a one-trick pony. If all a cleric did was heal, they'd get boring, too.

A warlock gets 2+ Int mod skill points per level, while a soulknife gets 4+Int mod per level. So while the warlock does get a good list of class skills he is not a skill monkey becasue he doesn't get a lot of skill points, in fact his sp generation is in the lowest bracket (2+Int mod).

But his invocations make his skill checks rather incredible, even without huge ability investments. His Charisma skills can be off the charts, and his Dex skills aren't going to be too shabby at all.

I absolutely agree the class is versatile and can contribute in a lot of ways - but at its core it is still a one-trick pony.

Only if you think the 'core' is the blast. I think the core is the invocations, and the blast is basically just a weapon. The blast is no more the core for the warlock than the +1 sword is the core for the fighter, or the holy avenger is the core for the paladin.

And I don't think I hae ever seen a majority opinion on the class that it is a "weak" class.

Wizards and psions sorcs blow stuff up better, rogues sneak better, bards face better....the warlock doesn't fill a niche that isn't better filled by another class....with the exception of "endurance." And if you're only doing a few encounters every day, endurance rarely comes up.

 

[Nightfall]

My warlock is chaotic good ranger/warlock with favored enemy Outsiders (Evil) - does this constitute an bad character to have in a "good" party? Or even one that would have difficulties with a paladin (any more so then say a cg ranger would)?

I was wondering that too. I mean the paladin might be a little more POed with a CN type than a CG type.
Sort of like this

CG character with Paladin
Paladin "Okay fine, you saved the village and stopped the dragon. But was it absolutely necessary to do that without a) coming up with a decent plan, b) finding a way that didn't involve allying with the evil necromancer or c) having that entire section burn down?

"Hey I achieved the most among of good possible, PLUS I managed to have the necromancer known to others so now the authorities can arrest him. It probably didn't work for you, but it certainly ensured we go the job done.

CN character with paladin.

Paladin "I'm really not happy here. First you hire an assassin to kill the king. THEN you assassinate the assassin to avoid paying him. Now you go off, hire a demon to kill the dragon and then expect us to clean up after you? What are you thinking?"

"Uhm least amount of work with the most amount of profit?"

See the difference?

 

[irdeggman]

Oh man, now you've got me wanting to play a Warlock/Soulknife gestalt! *drool*

Take Vow of Poverty and let the droolage really start.

 

[frankthedm]

CN character with paladin.

Paladin "I'm really not happy here. First you hire an assassin to kill the king. THEN you assassinate the assassin to avoid paying him. Now you go off, hire a demon to kill the dragon and then expect us to clean up after you? What are you thinking?"

"Uhm least amount of work with the most amount of profit?"

See the difference?

I see someone who confuses chaotic nuetral with chaotic evil.

 

[Thyrkill]

Thanks very much for the replies. From everything that was said, I believe that, though cool, the Warlock is not the class for me. I'll have to look into the Psion now...

Thanks,
Matt