Was AD&D1 designed for game balance?

[AllisterH]

re: low ability scores
1e, at least under Gygax, assumed you would have at LEAST 2 stats at a minimum of 15.

Again, where are people getting this idea that in 1e it was possible to play "weak" characters when Gygax explictly mentions, "No, you have to have at least two stats of 15+"

The only issue is why did the ability generation system have methods which would not result in such an outcome

re: Fighter followers.

If you look under the followers a 9th level fighter got, there was the troops and his personal guard. The leader of the personal guard was always a lower level fighter and he came with gear and the gear was better the higher the level the captain of the guard was.

To me anyway, that was a clear example of not so much as "WBL" but really just what the minimum amount of gear the melee classes would have.

 

[Vyvyan Basterd]

No doubt the advice could have been better -- this is always true, regardless of how good the advice is! But Gygax wrote the DMG in a stream-of-consciousness style that one either "got" or did not.

Or, as in my case, one eventually "got" it.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Or, as in my case, one eventually "got" it.

As you say.

Our perspectives change with time and experience.


RC

 

[howandwhy99]

No doubt the advice could have been better -- this is always true, regardless of how good the advice is! But Gygax wrote the DMG in a stream-of-consciousness style that one either "got" or did not.

At least it is fair to say that he increased many people's vocabularies!

I'll agree Gygax was a better game designer than author. And far from a technical writer. But the DMG does have a specific outline to it. Its' chapters are ordered as addenda to the PHB's.

 

[Vyvyan Basterd]

I'll agree Gygax was a better game designer than author. And far from a technical writer. But the DMG does have a specific outline to it. Its' chapters are ordered as addenda to the PHB's.

Yeah, but then you'd get what looked like a side thought. "Oh, by the way, creatures with thick hides are immune to the poison from the bites of fanged creatures..." That passage of the 1E DMG was my first (or at least most memorable) experience with rules lawyering as my snake bit the boar that a player had pulled from his Bag'O'Animals and directed me to this hidden nugget. I wondered why such information wouldn't be organized with the creature information in the MM.

 

[howandwhy99]

Yeah, but then you'd get what looked like a side thought. "Oh, by the way, creatures with thick hides are immune to the poison from the bites of fanged creatures..." That passage of the 1E DMG was my first (or at least most memorable) experience with rules lawyering as my snake bit the boar that a player had pulled from his Bag'O'Animals and directed me to this hidden nugget. I wondered why such information wouldn't be organized with the creature information in the MM.

Oh yeah. Far from a technical writer.

 

[Garmorn]

re: low ability scores
1e, at least under Gygax, assumed you would have at LEAST 2 stats at a minimum of 15.

Again, where are people getting this idea that in 1e it was possible to play "weak" characters when Gygax explictly mentions, "No, you have to have at least two stats of 15+"

The only issue is why did the ability generation system have methods which would not result in such an outcome

Because for many of us with out any Dragon Mags, or other ways of learning any thing but from the DMG and PH only had what was in them. I don't remember any thing in either that says any thing but roll 3d6 once for each stat in order. My first group was also one of those rare ones who did not have any posed base learners. We were all technically trained 20+ year old's over seas. One of my early wizards was made by the book 1st level 1 hit die int of about 14 - his highest stat who offensive spell was enlarge.

 

[MerricB]

I don't remember any thing in either that says any thing but roll 3d6 once for each stat in order.

Strangely enough, that's one instruction that AD&D doesn't have in it. The PH instructs players to ask the DM what ability score generation system they're using, and the DMG gives several systems, none of which is as simple as "3d6 six times".

Personally, I tended to use the system that said "roll 3d6 six times for each stat, taking the best roll each time".

Cheers!

 

[Garmorn]

Strangely enough, that's one instruction that AD&D doesn't have in it. The PH instructs players to ask the DM what ability score generation system they're using, and the DMG gives several systems, none of which is as simple as "3d6 six times".

Personally, I tended to use the system that said "roll 3d6 six times for each stat, taking the best roll each time".

Cheers!

Thanks, I was getting feeling. All of the games I played in 1e used that method. Of course I had 3 DM for 1e.

I never DMed 1e. I played it but never ran it because my game of choice was Rolemaster. I could wing it with out any prep at all for 10 hours straight and have my players beg for more.

 

[Lanefan]

Because for many of us with out any Dragon Mags, or other ways of learning any thing but from the DMG and PH only had what was in them. I don't remember any thing in either that says any thing but roll 3d6 once for each stat in order.

From the 1e DMG, p. 11, paraphrased:

Method I
Roll 4d6 for each stat, drop lowest, rearrange to suit

Method II
Roll 3d6 12 times, take the highest 6 scores, rearrange to suit

Method III
Roll 3d6 6 times for each stat and take the highest, do not rearrange

Method IV
Roll 3d6 once for each stat, do not rearrange; repeat 12 times, choose one set

A very long time ago, we started using Method I except with 5d6, and it's worked great ever since!

Lanefan