Ways to earn xp?

[VirgilCaine]

I would give xp for the full 40 badguys regardless of how they "overcame" them, so long as the PCs did it within their characters style/personality.

That's what I would do. I might even give more XP for the non-combat methods, since you don't see those often.

Now, if these were undead or demons or evil clerics or something that others would think bypassing in such a manner was a mistake, they might take some flak for it from the appropriate source--Paladin, Good cleric, etc.
Now, goblins or derro or chagmats or something that moved in and wasn't necessarily especially offensive, they probably wouldn't get any flak.

 

[TheEvil]

In the example (#6), the PCs completely avoided the obstacles. They didn't "deal with the obstacles". Now, if digging the hole meant concealing the effort from the badguys, or misdirecting the badguys, or holding off the badguys, or something else like that, then sure, they get xp. But if the badguys are *completely* avoided, they don't give xp.

If an ogre is guarding a path in the woods, and PCs walk an extra 3 miles out of their way to avoid encountering it, do they get xp? They may still reach their destination, but they didn't overcome the ogre obstacle. That's how I saw #6.

Well, if they completely avoid B (and I mean "completely avoid", vs. find a way through or around), why give them xp for B? Do you give xp for encounters completely avoided? (See above.)

If they overcome X to get at $, then shouldn't they get xp for X, not B? And what is the xp for 20 feet of rock wall? (And did the PCs overcome the rock wall, or did the sappers?)

And I ask again, for those of you who say you'd give xp for the mcguffin: how do you figure the xp value of it if not based off overcoming the obstacle(s) to getting it?

Quasqueton

What is the difference between Going Around and Completely Avoiding if you still get the mcguffin? It seems to me the only time you have Completely Avoided is when you don't get the mcguffin. The ogre example doesn't really apply because there is no mcguffin involved.

As far as the rest of it, it seems you are getting a bit hung up on the math. As long as the players and the GM are comfortable with the rate of advancement, does it really matter if the numbers say that they made their next level or not?

I would definately agree with bruiser said. In one game, we spent several sessions roleplaying (tracking down a temple with a priest powerful enough to raise a character and being rewarded for past deeds) and killing monsters too weak to qualify for xp (containing monsters that were infesting the countryside). We got no xp for several sessions. It was rather frustrating and certainly didn't make me want to go to any great efforts to roleplay in the future.

 

[Quasqueton]

As far as the rest of it, it seems you are getting a bit hung up on the math.

No, I'm not getting hung up on anything. Just discussing. Trying to hit it from all different angles.

What is the difference between Going Around and Completely Avoiding if you still get the mcguffin? It seems to me the only time you have Completely Avoided is when you don't get the mcguffin. The ogre example doesn't really apply because there is no mcguffin involved.

Is a mcguffin necessary to the xp calculation?

With the ogre example, isn't Point B the "mcguffin" (assuming the PCs started at Point A)?

How about a straight combat with no "purpose"? A duel challenge accepted and overcome---is there no xp for that?

Quasqueton

 

[stevelabny]

fighting = full xp instantly

everything else = full xp when the adventure is completely over. If you sucessfully get in, you still have to get out. If these are the type of people who will pursue you to regain the mcguffin, then you still won't get the XP until you deal with them. (No getting XP multiple times for the same obstacle)

 

[Starglim]

I'd like to add that I think #6 above is actually avoiding the challenge, and I probably would not award xp for the 40 badguys in that instance.

Several folks here have mentioned awarding xp for the mcguffin. How do you calculate the xp for an item? Do you have seperate xp for the badguys *and* the item? I mean, the badguys are the obstacle, right?

I would say that #6 is a valid way of overcoming the obstacle, with the small caveat that the experience they earned must be shared equally with the sapping crew.

 

[Thornir Alekeg]

I'd like to add that I think #6 above is actually avoiding the challenge, and I probably would not award xp for the 40 badguys in that instance.

Several folks here have mentioned awarding xp for the mcguffin. How do you calculate the xp for an item? Do you have seperate xp for the badguys *and* the item? I mean, the badguys are the obstacle, right?

Quasqueton

I use more of a story award system for XP. In the end, the goal (get the mcguffin) and the challenge (40 bad guys) are linked. If you kill all the bad guys but for some reason don't get the mcguffin (lets say you collapsed the cave and were unable to get it) should you get the same XP? Is the point only to kill things and overcome challenges or is it to accomplish goals? In my mind the goal is actually more important, that's why I give most of the XP for getting the mcguffin. I also give XP for overcoming challenges, how much will vary based upon how creative or how risky the path chosen is. I use the tables in the DMG as a guide, but I do not take them as gospel. It is a very loosey-goosey system, and in the end as long as my players feel they are being rewarded fairly, that is all that matters.