We went from 5 saving throws to...64!

[Emirikol]

I remember when there were only 5 saving throws..now there are 64. Why do saving throws still exist when there is such a wide array of skills?


http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/charactersheets

jh

 

[Ibram]

Saving throws are usualy passive, while skills are active in nature.

 

[Umbran]

I remember when there were only 5 saving throws..now there are 64. Why do saving throws still exist when there is such a wide array of skills?

Saving throws advance with the character in a fundamentally different manner than skills do, and so are handled separately.

Could you rewrite saving throws to be skills? Probably. But I think that would throw the skill system rather out of kilter - a point of skill really isn't worth as much as a point of saving throw, in general.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

I remember when there were only 5 saving throws..now there are 64.

What? 64? My latest counts yielded three (which make a lot more sense than the previous 5).


And saves shouldn't be skills. I could see something directly done by ability scores, but the current systems has its advantages.

If you introduced them as skills, they'd automatically be maxed out by all characters. And you'd have to make the attack bonus a skill, too (which would also be maxed out by everyone). So instead of making "must-have" skills, they kept them different.

There are games without attack bonus and saving throw, but those are usually not level- or class-based.

 

[Snapdragyn]

Hrm. I followed the link, opened up the character sheet pdf...

Fortitude
Reflex
Will

I count that as 3, not 5 or 64.

 

[Crothian]

My character sheet and rule books have three saving throws.

 

[Deekin]

Saving throws were reduced from five categories based on forms of attack to three based on type of defense: Fortitude, Reflex, and Will.

Non-weapon proficiencies were replaced by skills, and became a fundamental part of the game rather than an optional one, with class abilities such as thieving skills being translated directly into skills. All characters are given a pool of points to spend on a wide range of specific skills to further define a character.

 

[Sejs]

I remember when there were only 5 saving throws..now there are 64. Why do saving throws still exist when there is such a wide array of skills?


http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/charactersheets

jh

Uh.. huh.

Care to explain where you're getting that 64 number from? 'Cause I'm just not seeing it.

 

[Deekin]

For some reason he is reading skills as saving throws?

 

[Thurbane]

Well, I suppose you could treat Balance and Escape Artist as saving throws, of a sort...

...and then there are ability checks...

...still, 64?