Weapon Finesse (Unarmed Strike)

[Saepiroth]

hell, there's a Large weapon that you can apply it to, too. Spiked Chain, anyone?

 

[Andion Isurand]

What about applying weapon finess to attacks made with a saber while mounted?

How would you people rule that?

 

[aliensex]

Aren't the Sabre and Rapier essentially the same thing in D&D? The weapon illustration for the Rapier looks a heck of a lot like a Sabre to me, but anyways...

If I'm right and they are the same thing, then yes, weapon finess applies if you can wield it 1 handed. It doesn't matter if you are on a horse or not, you still get you dexterity modifier, so you can use it normally.

 

[kigmatzomat]

Aren't the Sabre and Rapier essentially the same thing in D&D? The weapon illustration for the Rapier looks a heck of a lot like a Sabre to me, but anyways...

They can look the same, being more or less cousins, but they aren't. Sabres are slashing weapons, rapiers are piercing weapons. Sabres are fairly weighty to enhance the power of the slash while rapiers are intentionally light to allow quick control of the tip. Sabres do have sharp points just as rapiers have sharpened blades, but it is not the primary function and it's obvious if you handle the two weapons side by side.

I have a heavy rapier that from the side is sabre-sized. I could use it to slash, but it would do badly because it is too light. The shop had an almost identical sabre which was half-again as thick and far more unweildy (at least for the tactics I learned from combat fencing with epees) but it seemed like it screamed at me to swing it at arms length to smash something.

Never understimate the power of leverage. That slight thickening of the blade doesn't mean much at the hilt, but 20" from your hand it starts seriously cranking up the momentum & inertia.

 

[Spatula]

If i recall correctly under the decription of rapier in PHB a rapier is consider a light weapon for people that can wield it in one hand.

A rapier, being medium-sized, is not a light weapon for medium-sized characters. That would imply you could wield one in your off-hand and not suffer the more severe two-weapon fighting penalties, and that's not the case. The rapier and the spiked chain are just exceptions to the Weapon Finesse feat being restricted to light weapons.

 

[aliensex]

They can look the same, being more or less cousins, but they aren't. Sabres are slashing weapons, rapiers are piercing weapons. Sabres are fairly weighty to enhance the power of the slash while rapiers are intentionally light to allow quick control of the tip. Sabres do have sharp points just as rapiers have sharpened blades, but it is not the primary function and it's obvious if you handle the two weapons side by side.

I have a heavy rapier that from the side is sabre-sized. I could use it to slash, but it would do badly because it is too light. The shop had an almost identical sabre which was half-again as thick and far more unweildy (at least for the tactics I learned from combat fencing with epees) but it seemed like it screamed at me to swing it at arms length to smash something.

Never understimate the power of leverage. That slight thickening of the blade doesn't mean much at the hilt, but 20" from your hand it starts seriously cranking up the momentum & inertia.

Oh, I'm well aware of what they are in real life. I was talking from a game perspective. I believe D&D has just lumped them under the Rapier statistics (hence the illustration in the weapons chapter). I was just trying to clarify what Andion was asking.

 

[Staffan]

I'd probably classify a saber as a scimitar instead - a curved slashing blade. That would, of course, mean that it can't be used with weapon finesse.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

I've noticed several DMs that allow Weapon Finesse: Scimitar. Since that issue has never come up in my games, I've never given it any thought.

I'm inclined to think Scimitars are finessable.

 

[Bauglir]

Uhh, I think Bauglir was kidding, guys.

Nope, was just a case of 'skimmed the feat, applied it for a long time using common sense (A rapier seems to me like a weapon one could use with finesse)'

If you do things a certain way for a long enough time, it can seem like a rule, even if it's not. Then you see the rule quoted, and think 'wait a minute...'

 

[drnuncheon]

If you do things a certain way for a long enough time, it can seem like a rule, even if it's not. Then you see the rule quoted, and think 'wait a minute...'

It is a rule. I just didn't quote the complete rule because it wasn't relevant to unarmed strikes.

J