What are the worst classic D&D adventure modules?

[billd91]

I really don't want or intend to get into an argument to defend ToEE, but. . .

Gygax's name is on Q1 (with Sutherland) also, and he though he wrote well of it in the adventure preface itself, he disavowed it later. Gygax's name is on OA and he disavowed it as well.

But ToEE has his name (as well as Mentzer), and he never distanced himself from it. It is written and designed in the same style as other works he wrote 100%. I understand that Mentzer organized/assembled ToEE from Gygax's manuscripts and notes, but this is the first time I've ever seen anyone try to seperate Gygax from ToEE.

Are you looking at the text as you write this? I'm not, but I've read it many times. If I'm remembering correctly, (and I'll check when I'm home in a couple hours), the chance of Iuz showing up to a calling is only 5%. Cuthbert will show up 90% only if Iuz comes first. And even if this 5% chance is rolled, the gods will merely revive any dead mortal combatants, and then vanish to settle their issues in private.

So there is no "watch the gods fight" in that. 95% chance that no gods show up at all, 5% chance to they show up for a few seconds and then disappear.

ToEE has flaws, sure. But don't call out flaws that aren't there.

Bullgrit

I can understand Gygax not distancing himself from it, T1 is his work and T1-4 incorporates it.

And yes, I'm looking at the text. You also don't want to defile Iuz's altar. No Iuz cultist necessary to bring Iuz to the party on that one.

 

[Bullgrit]

Just found this here on ENWorld:

He did only the 3rd and 4th levels of the ToEE to the best of my knowledge, stepping in to complete the place when I was too busy to get to the project in a timely manner.

http://www.enworld.org/forum/archive-threads/193204-gary-gygax-q-part-xiii-25.html#post3778940

That;s when Frank Mentzer took a hand and filled in the lower levels that I hadn't detailed. That's why they ended where they did instrad of proceeding downwards more to where the EEG's area was going to be.

http://www.enworld.org/forum/archive-threads/46861-q-gary-gygax-pt-3-a-9.html#post987398
Interesting to note that the dungeon crawl was intended to be even bigger.

There are 4 levels to the temple, plus the nodes, plus the moathouse. So if Mentzer did levels 3 and 4, that means the majority of the adventure was by Gygax.

Bullgrit

 

[billd91]

Interesting to note that the dungeon crawl was intended to be even bigger.

There are 4 levels to the temple, plus the nodes, plus the moathouse. So if Mentzer did levels 3 and 4, that means the majority of the adventure was by Gygax.

Bullgrit

Does it really matter how much was whose? The thing needed a serious editing as far as I am concerned. Making it even longer (without tightening its focus) would probably only prolong the boredom.

 

[KidSnide]

Also, I still have to go with the the Avatar Triogy as the worst I've ever tried to play. It was King of the static cutscene -- even the Dragonlance modules don't approach it. It was like playing through Hamlet as Rosenkrantz and Guildenstern, except you don't have the relief of dying part way through.

Wow... you tried to play those? At least some of the Dragonlance modules read well. The Avatar modules read like... well... umm...

Let's just say that they compare poorly with watching the GM play solitaire for six hours.

-KS

 

[Bullgrit]

Looking at the text now:

If a Temple leader calls, 90% chance for Iuz to come. If Iuz comes, 90% chance for St. Cuthbert to come. If they show up, they will revive any fallen followers “with a gesture,” and then “will vanish together in a puff of smoke and thunderclap, as they will not discuss or settle their differences in the presence of their followers or other mortals.”

So, though I got the percentages wrong, there still is no “watch the gods fight” in this. If the gods show up, they only revive their followers and then go away again.

Does it really matter how much was whose?

Well it apparently mattered when y'all said it wasn't really Gygax's. Now that we see it was really/mostly Gygax's, it doesn't really matter anymore.

Bullgrit

 

[billd91]

Well it apparently mattered when y'all said it wasn't really Gygax's. Now that we see it was really/mostly Gygax's, it doesn't really matter anymore.

Bullgrit

Go back and reread my posts. It never mattered to me.

 

[Erik Mona]

Interesting. I appreciate you digging through the Q&A thread on that, as I always thought Frank did all four levels based on some notes from Gary. I wasn't aware that Gary designed the first couple levels.

Anyway, you're right that the gods don't actually fight each other. I still think their appearance in the module is pretty lame, regardless.

--Erik

 

[Lanefan]

Worst TSR modules I've ever had the (dis)pleasure of running and-or playing in:

1. Night's Dark Terror. Some of the set-piece battles are fine, but the threads that hold it all together are tenuous at best and easily missed by the players - and the DM, unless her reading and comprehension skills are very very good. My party, after losing enough people to turn over its entire membership twice, packed it in before ever reaching the Lost Valley bit and went elsewhere.

2. To Find a King and the companion one (I forget the name) that comes after it. These two modules are actually a series of 8 little vignette-size adventures that get really boring after about the first two. That said, the very last 'otherworld' bit holds some merit - my suggestion would be to pluck it out and use it somewhere else.

3. About a tie between Dragons of Winter Ice (what are minotaurs, a sub-tropical species, doing living in the high arctic???) and any of the single-player ones (Forest Oracle, Elven Quest, etc.)

But if you want to really step into the badness, turn away from TSR and check out some of the stuff Judges' Guild was putting out in that era. With TSR, it was generally a matter of finding and avoiding the relatively few bad ones. With JG is was like panning for gold in a muddy river - usually, all you got was mud. But even if you found gold (and half a dozen or so of their modules are at least vaguely decent e.g. Tower of Ullision, Maltese Clue) it'd usually still need a complete rewrite before you could play it.

Lan-"there was a lot of mud"-efan

 

[meomwt]

A real clunker from the dying days of 2E: The Crypt of Lyzandred the Mad.

You get: maps of two levels of interconnecting chambers, numbered, totalling 50 locations in all; 100 unkeyed room descriptions containing logical, word and mathematical puzzles; instructions "to put them together as the DM desires."

So to run an adventure which consists of the players solving lots of puzzles, the DM has to put together all the donkey work.

Luckily, my group heard the word "Lich" and headed out of range in double-time, so I didn't have to disappoint them with this stinker.

 

[Celebrim]

I've used this module to show my girlfriend what D&D was about, and she loved it. I've DM'ed this module for an ex-girlfriend and her (female) friends, and they loved it. Name me any other "classic" module with a vibe that makes it attractive to casual, first-time, female players.

UK1: Beyond the Crystal Cave