The_Gneech
Explorer
Bendris Noulg said:
Sorry, never heard of it! "Great googily-moogily" is pretty generic AFAIK...
-TG
What ever happened to "role playing?"
- Thread starter Lokishadow
- Start date
Sorry, never heard of it! "Great googily-moogily" is pretty generic AFAIK...
-TG
the Jester
Legend
As others have said, I think you've just had a string of bad luck.
My game has a mix of combat and roleplaying. Most of the time it seems to be about 50/50 lately, but there are strings of sessions with all combat or all rp sometimes, so you can't really judge the game by a single session.
Diaglo's right about life being too short, though; if the game's not fun after four sessions, maybe see if you can set up a side game with any other dissatisfied players.
My game has a mix of combat and roleplaying. Most of the time it seems to be about 50/50 lately, but there are strings of sessions with all combat or all rp sometimes, so you can't really judge the game by a single session.
Diaglo's right about life being too short, though; if the game's not fun after four sessions, maybe see if you can set up a side game with any other dissatisfied players.
WizarDru
Adventurer
I had used the phrase for years, but it's something of a catch-phrase for one of the characters (the Ferocious Beast of the title) on the Nick Jr. show of that name. Cute show, but my kids have grown out of it. They still will watch some Nick jr. stuff, but are just as prone to Jackie Chan Adventures, Shaman King or Teen Titans, now.The_Gneech said:Sorry, never heard of it! "Great googily-moogily" is pretty generic AFAIK...
-TG
On the plus side, Johnny Quest season one comes out on DVD...TOMORROW! GLEEE! Can't wait to share those with the kids.
Sholari
First Post
Loki,
I definitely hear you in terms of more games being about roll playing than role playing these days. Since my undergrad days I have yet to find a game where the story element is really that compelling. When you talk to most DMs these days they think of themselves as fairly well-rounded. However, when I've tried their game out they usually fall into two categories: 1) DMs where the plot is nothing than a bunch of linked combats to get to some generic objective or 2) a by the book DM who can not handle anything outside of the module they are using. (This does not mean that all DMs out there are that way, just the majority that I have run into).
I do not think it is the game system that is the cause, although I have noticed a rise in this predisposition with the popularity of D&D 3.x. I think it really boils down to the most recent generation of roleplayers. Raised on Playstation and CCGs they have had a ton of exposure to action and mechanics, but very little exposure to story elements. I think the current iteration of D&D reflects really reflects their values. So as players they are more concerned with what their next prestige class is going to be rather than what is going on behind the scenes in the campaign. As DMs they tend to be good at orchestrating involved combats, but not very good at coming up with an interesting plot structure. Their purchasing patterns also reflect this. There are a lot of people buying mechanics and prestige class books and far fewer people buying modules.
For quite awhile I was bothered by this trend, but I realized it is just the natural process as one generation replaces the next. While the current game I am playing in does not have much of a story element behind it, I think my current DM is excellent in his rules knowledge and at orchestrating combat. I've definitely improved my own grasp of this in 3.5 because of him and plan to apply it to my own game if I find the time to start running a campaign again.
I definitely hear you in terms of more games being about roll playing than role playing these days. Since my undergrad days I have yet to find a game where the story element is really that compelling. When you talk to most DMs these days they think of themselves as fairly well-rounded. However, when I've tried their game out they usually fall into two categories: 1) DMs where the plot is nothing than a bunch of linked combats to get to some generic objective or 2) a by the book DM who can not handle anything outside of the module they are using. (This does not mean that all DMs out there are that way, just the majority that I have run into).
I do not think it is the game system that is the cause, although I have noticed a rise in this predisposition with the popularity of D&D 3.x. I think it really boils down to the most recent generation of roleplayers. Raised on Playstation and CCGs they have had a ton of exposure to action and mechanics, but very little exposure to story elements. I think the current iteration of D&D reflects really reflects their values. So as players they are more concerned with what their next prestige class is going to be rather than what is going on behind the scenes in the campaign. As DMs they tend to be good at orchestrating involved combats, but not very good at coming up with an interesting plot structure. Their purchasing patterns also reflect this. There are a lot of people buying mechanics and prestige class books and far fewer people buying modules.
For quite awhile I was bothered by this trend, but I realized it is just the natural process as one generation replaces the next. While the current game I am playing in does not have much of a story element behind it, I think my current DM is excellent in his rules knowledge and at orchestrating combat. I've definitely improved my own grasp of this in 3.5 because of him and plan to apply it to my own game if I find the time to start running a campaign again.
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yup yup
I've seen some of this before, but by and large I've been lucky in my groups over the last ten years. We love a good story and I especially love to make someone's own backstory haunt, frighten, or just plain surprise them. I guess, on the whole, it depends on what kind of DM they've gamed under, and whether or not the group wants more in depth games. My suggestion if your having a hard time finding a group (try D&D Meetup?) then offer to run. It will give you the chance to show them the value of an in depth story to follow, not just a blood trail. Don't get me wrong, some good ole hack-n-slash can be a blast, but a cool storyline can make things more immersive. I've always found it really springs from the world environment, are there interesting cultures to explore (and possibly make a new character from) and interesting people and places to be in awe and fear of. Here's hoping you find a good group, and a good game.
I've seen some of this before, but by and large I've been lucky in my groups over the last ten years. We love a good story and I especially love to make someone's own backstory haunt, frighten, or just plain surprise them. I guess, on the whole, it depends on what kind of DM they've gamed under, and whether or not the group wants more in depth games. My suggestion if your having a hard time finding a group (try D&D Meetup?) then offer to run. It will give you the chance to show them the value of an in depth story to follow, not just a blood trail. Don't get me wrong, some good ole hack-n-slash can be a blast, but a cool storyline can make things more immersive. I've always found it really springs from the world environment, are there interesting cultures to explore (and possibly make a new character from) and interesting people and places to be in awe and fear of. Here's hoping you find a good group, and a good game.
tetsujin28
First Post
1976Henry said:
I think in many ways, I was a better and (much more narrativist) GM back then than I am now.Henry said:
Ralts Bloodthorne
First Post
Well, SEAL Team Orc that was not, from what I saw...
The cliff was a little bogus, I'll grant that, but not a game killer.
OK, time to hear from the Powergamer DM...
First of all, your heading toward: "We then continued with our plan to infiltrate the orc keep to the southwest." and are suprised when the "SEAL Team Orc. 16 orcs, each of them 4th level fighters or rangers, with their chainmail stowed in their packs (so it wouldn't make noise) and wearing Masterwork Studded Leather, and cross-classed ranks in Move Silently and Hide, snuck up on our campsite and ambushed us. "
Hmmm, I guess, in part of your desire to return to ROLE-Playing, the monsters should suddenly become retarded, clomp around, and act like doofuses? Players can do it, so can the monsters. It's the flip side of the "The is no DM specific material in 3.x E" that everyone seems so enamored with lately.
While the numbers were high (16 of them) for the 9 of you, it wasn't unheard of, and sometimes, you get ambushed and cut apart in real life too.
Anyway, let me stop this before I get started.
Reading that, I think that while some of the problem has to do with the GM, some of it lies with you, and the rest lies with the both of you.
Incompatible playing style.
Complaints over a tough, VERY hard encounter.
Bad call on the blizzard.
Comparing your DMing style with his.
Personally, I'd like to hear about the second game.
The cliff was a little bogus, I'll grant that, but not a game killer.
OK, time to hear from the Powergamer DM...
First of all, your heading toward: "We then continued with our plan to infiltrate the orc keep to the southwest." and are suprised when the "SEAL Team Orc. 16 orcs, each of them 4th level fighters or rangers, with their chainmail stowed in their packs (so it wouldn't make noise) and wearing Masterwork Studded Leather, and cross-classed ranks in Move Silently and Hide, snuck up on our campsite and ambushed us. "
Hmmm, I guess, in part of your desire to return to ROLE-Playing, the monsters should suddenly become retarded, clomp around, and act like doofuses? Players can do it, so can the monsters. It's the flip side of the "The is no DM specific material in 3.x E" that everyone seems so enamored with lately.
While the numbers were high (16 of them) for the 9 of you, it wasn't unheard of, and sometimes, you get ambushed and cut apart in real life too.
Anyway, let me stop this before I get started.
Reading that, I think that while some of the problem has to do with the GM, some of it lies with you, and the rest lies with the both of you.
Incompatible playing style.
Complaints over a tough, VERY hard encounter.
Bad call on the blizzard.
Comparing your DMing style with his.
Personally, I'd like to hear about the second game.
Sargon the Kassadian
First Post
My Theory
I hope I don't offend anyone with this, but my theory is that the advent of 3E and 3.5 have made D&D more accessible and cooler to the modern day nerd. At the same time (there are lots of these people at my school) the modern day nerd/D&D player is no longer so smart. There are a lot more people, and thus a lot more "dumb" people (typically powergamers/munchkins) playing and DMing today.
PS: feel free to bash me since I'm only 15 and my ideas may be naive
I hope I don't offend anyone with this, but my theory is that the advent of 3E and 3.5 have made D&D more accessible and cooler to the modern day nerd. At the same time (there are lots of these people at my school) the modern day nerd/D&D player is no longer so smart. There are a lot more people, and thus a lot more "dumb" people (typically powergamers/munchkins) playing and DMing today.
PS: feel free to bash me since I'm only 15 and my ideas may be naive
WizarDru
Adventurer
Heh. Naive? Not at all. You're merely lacking in perspective.Sargon the Kassadian said:
Trust me, 20 years ago, D&D was a FAD. Imagine if every kid who was in to Yu-Gi-Oh! was playing D&D instead, and you'll get the idea. Many of us kept playing, and a large number (perhaps even the majority) played for a short while, grew bored or disinterested and moved on.
Trust me, the nerd bar hasn't been lowered. Some might argue it was never as high as some folks like to think. (Heck, we've had threads here on ENWorld on that very subject).
