What happens when you crit with an incorporeal touch?

[tennyson]

Hi Everyone,

I've been searching through all of my books and haven't been able to find the answer to this question. In my group's last session, one of the PCs went head-to-head with a shadow. Unfortunately, the shadow crit with its incorporeal touch and did 5 points of temp strength damage to the PC.

Because it was a crit, the ruling was that the damage was doubled (as it would be with any normal weapon), making it 10 points of temp strength damage. To our great surprise, that ended up killing the PC who only had a strength score of 7.

Anyway, the battle went on for two rounds and the shadow that had killed the PC was eventually killed itself. According to the rules, any subject brought to 0 strength by a shadow dies and is brought back as a shadow under the killer's control in 1d4 rounds (3 rounds in our case). We ruled that since the shadow who killed the PC was destroyed before the PC was brought back a shadow, the character just died.

Here are my two questions:

1. Was the ruling that the damage was doubled correct?
2. Should the character have come back as a shadow even though his killer was destroyed?

Sorry for the long-winded post. Thanks for your answers!

 

[Artoomis]

Well, as you know, a shadow does 1d6 of temp str damage. On a confirmed critical hit it should do "2d6," not "1d6 x 2," so doubling the "5" result was not correct unless, of course, you rolled again and got another "5."

As for the death itself, DM's call in this case. When in doubt, I give the benefit to the players if it involves a PC death.

 

[Pax]

Hi Everyone,

I've been searching through all of my books and haven't been able to find the answer to this question. In my group's last session, one of the PCs went head-to-head with a shadow. Unfortunately, the shadow crit with its incorporeal touch and did 5 points of temp strength damage to the PC.

Because it was a crit, the ruling was that the damage was doubled (as it would be with any normal weapon), making it 10 points of temp strength damage. To our great surprise, that ended up killing the PC who only had a strength score of 7.

Anyway, the battle went on for two rounds and the shadow that had killed the PC was eventually killed itself. According to the rules, any subject brought to 0 strength by a shadow dies and is brought back as a shadow under the killer's control in 1d4 rounds (3 rounds in our case). We ruled that since the shadow who killed the PC was destroyed before the PC was brought back a shadow, the character just died.

Here are my two questions:

1. Was the ruling that the damage was doubled correct?

To the best of my knowledge -- yes.

ANY time you actually have to roll to hit, you can score a critical hit; when not specified, assume the critical threat entry for any given attack is "20/x2".

2. Should the character have come back as a shadow even though his killer was destroyed?

Sorry for the long-winded post. Thanks for your answers!

Yes, he should have. He would also have qualified for the Emancipated Spawn prestige class in Savage Species.

However, depending on the character and player, this may have presented significant screwage ... since raise dead (etc) only works if the dead person is WILLING, and being undead usually means they are NOT willing ...

 

[nimisgod]

1. "If an attack that causes ability damage scores a critical hit, it dreals twice the listed amount (if the damage is expressed as a die range, roll two dice)" -MM pg. 8

2. "Any humanoid reduced to Strength 0 by a Shadow becomes a Shadow under the control of its killer within 1d4 rounds" MM pg.161

This is kinda iffy, mainly because it doesn't say per se that the corruption into a Shadow is interrupted by the Killer's "death".

There are precedents of undead with Create Spawn and their Spawn doesn't necessarily die at the Creator's death. Wight Spawn and Vampire Spawn are enslaved to their master's will until their deaths. Afterwards, they are freewilled undead.

We can assume then that the spawning process of 1d4 rounds cannot be interrupted.

I could look for more, but sleep calls...