D&D 5E What if the D&D Core outsells the revised D&D Core?

[Parmandur]

Wow. So you are expecting some game engine updates?

Things like clarifying unarmed strike versus natural weapon versus melee weapon attack?

The rearrangements could be cosmetic for ease of access. But you suspected they add, delete, and or tweak rules?

I really don't expect any fundamental changes, but things like you suggest there certainly seem plausible. I'd look at the 38 pages of the Sage Advice Compendium for suspects for rewriting (though again, not at a fundamental level). But we do know own from the screenshits that the new Starter Set is shaking things up in that core area, and I suspect it's what we will see reprinted in the nee Core books.

 

[Yaarel]

I suspect WotC will never call the anniversary edition "5.5".

In the past designers regretted doing "3.5" in hindsight. They felt it would be better to just plan toward a new edition with substantial changes.

So, it will either be 5e or 6e − or a noncommittal "anniversary edition".

 

[MGibster]

This sort of thing isn't without precedent...I mean, "New Coke" was a thing that happened. But it would have to be a royal flop, on the same magnitude as New Coke. Unlikely, but possible I suppose.

I would argue that D&D 4th edition was a pretty big flop.

What advantage does WotC gain by calling it 6e?

Calling it 6th edition helps new players avoid any confusion on which set of rules they're buying.

 

[Zardnaar]

Fairly simple if it tanks we get 6E eventually. What form 6E will be no idea.
If it tank they'll purge whatever turns people off or whatever they percieve turns people off.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

What kind of new rules do you suspect we will see?

(Druid becoming owlbear is no big deal. It is still the same game engine.)

I mean, we already know some of the changes. "Race" will become "Ancestry" and will (to some extent or another) de-emphasize rigid ability score associations, for example. And it's pretty clear they're switching to PB/LR resources rather than SR resources, even if they haven't explicitly said that.

As for probable changes, I expect:

• A major rework of the Ranger class. This is the one class they've repeatedly and explicitly said has issues, talking about player feedback over the course of years with multiple attempts to fix it. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised if this is one of the bigger secondary reasons for a revision, because they don't want to issue major errata for the PHB but aren't happy with the existing Ranger.
• Partial reworks of (in order of likelihood and severity) the Warlock, Monk, Sorcerer, Fighter, Rogue, and Wizard classes. Warlocks are very likely to get tweaks because of the shift to PB/LR, which will require their pact magic to adapt. Wizards, although they don't really need a rework, are somewhat notorious for having few class features and not really expressing their theme of "scholarly hermetic mage," so a minor touch-up to address this could be included. More or less, the first three are "probable rework of varying degrees" while the latter three are "possible rework of varying degrees."
• Heavy to moderate reworks of several subclasses, but particularly the Champion, Berserker, Beast Master, Four Elements, and (possibly) Circle of the Moon. All of these have gotten criticism at some point, or have proven to be below par compared to subsequent options, or have some kind of mechanical wrinkle that would welcome changes.
• Changes to some feats, possibly trying to beef up (or trim out) some of the "bad" feats and bring down the power of some of the "strong" feats.
• Changes to some equipment, possibly removing redundant items like the trident, or finding ways to make them distinctive/worthwhile.
• Under-the-hood changes to certain monster math, hard to predict exactly what because 5e monster math isn't exactly transparent, but I expect at least SOME changes here.
• Reworking several spells, probably making more spells depend on Concentration than current. Might or might not see some shuffling of spell lists.

In other words, it will be "backwards-compatible" in the way 3e and 3.5e were: a lot of stuff will work essentially identically, and you don't truly need to rewrite your character sheet if you happen to be using the "old" version of something. All the old adventures should work with either no changes or very minimal changes, they just might not be optimal. But those old things won't be supported anymore.

I suspect WotC will never call the anniversary edition "5.5".

In the past designers regretted doing "3.5" in hindsight. They felt it would be better to just plan toward a new edition with substantial changes.

So, it will either be 5e or 6e − or a noncommittal "anniversary edition".

If they don't actually call it 5.5e, then yes, calling it D&D 50th Anniversary Edition or "5th Edition 50th Anniversary" or something like that is almost certainly what they'll do. Which means we'll probably end up calling it 5.50 or the like.

 

[delericho]

It just struck me, what if WotC revises the core books but the originals continue to sell like they do now? What happens if they outperform the new core books? What happens if they out preform them a lot?

When the new books are released, the old ones will be removed from production. Indeed, that will happen some time before 5.5e releases, in the hope that any stocks out there will be depleted before the release. So they shouldn't be in competition with each other.

As for the sales comparison: with one exception, each time they've put out a PHB it has sold fewer copies than its predecessor, so it wouldn't be unexpected with the move to 5.5e. That said, the one exception I mentioned is 5e, and it has been selling ridiculously well for years now, so we're in unprecedented times... so who knows?

But if 5.5e does basically tank, and we go back to 3e/4e sales numbers, then I rather suspect WotC's response will be to reduce output sharply and just let the game lie fallow for a number of years prior to (maybe) issuing a full-on 6e at some point. Because I no longer believe D&D sales numbers really has much to do with the quality of the game at all - it seems more to be down to something in the culture, and once this moment comes to an end I don't think any edition would really do much better.

(That last, incidentally, is not a comment on the quality of 5e, which is a very good game and a very good edition of the game. It's just that markets are bizarre and fickle things.)

 

[darjr]

Going back to the original 5e plan? That sounds plausible and maybe workable.

 

[darjr]

I resurrect this thread and ask

Now what do you think?

 

[mamba]

What would you do if you were WotC?

What do you think WotC would do?

It just struck me, what if WotC revises the core books but the originals continue to sell like they do now? What happens if they outperform the new core books? What happens if they out preform them a lot?

for how long? I assume at that point 5e can only sell what is in the channel still, WotC won’t be printing more.

Also, that seems pretty far fetched as the 5e books only sell to people new to the hobby, the ones having them already do not need them a second time. Even if only 10% of those upgraded, that would still outsell newcomers (even if all of those went with 5e, which is highly unlikely)

 

[Ruin Explorer]

I resurrect this thread and ask

Now what do you think?

I think they're going to just straight-up replace the line and stop printing the 5E PHB, DMG and MM, as well as ceasing to sell them on D&D Beyond.

I suspect they will still be available through Roll 20 and Fantasy Grounds, and I'm sure they'll remain on D&D Beyond as "Legacy" for people who already have them, they just won't be available for new purchases. Physical copies will still be at your FLGS and Amazon and so on, but no new ones will be printed. People will complain that some handful of subclasses from the 5E PHB which didn't make the cut in the 1D&D PHB aren't available anymore, but WotC will probably put revised versions of them in some early 1D&D book.

If 1D&D is somehow unpopular, they'll probably try and tough it out, and to use marketing and D&D Beyond to try and make up for that. I don't think there's the remotest chance they'll "go back to 5E" or start printing/selling it again. Even if it goes poorly, I'd expect them to just make 7E sooner, or for Hasbro to consider selling WotC, than for them to "go back to 5E".

But as it's a 1E-2E-type edition change, not a 3E-4E one, I think the worst case scenario is slightly less/slower sales than hoped, and any number of schemes can be used to increase adoption. Also don't expect to see any particularly successful attempts to "Pathfinder" the situation, because that only worked because of 4E being so different to 3.XE.