What is "an attack"?

[Black Knight Irios]

I know this question was the topic of some heated discussions, and maybe an official answer to this question exists but I couldn't find it (I browsed the first 5 pages but there are more than 100).

Dear folks, would you please give me a link to a thread with an official answer or post the official answer (if it exists!).

I wouldn't be happy if you told me there was still nothing official after all.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

An attack happens when d20 are rolled to hit. If its a melee or ranged attack type each roll is an attack, in the case of area or close attack types all rolls for the power use generally constitute a single attack.

The only time the word is used to mean anything else is in the general sense of things like 'the enemy attacks', 'when you attack', or similar text where the rules text is dealing with general situations.

The 'controversy' is much overblown, there is little to no ambiguity. I doubt there will be an errata simply because it isn't really needed. An FAQ entry on the topic apparently would help clear this up for some people though. So far there hasn't been one.

 

[Zaran]

I think the ambiguity is from things like Cleave and other attacks that have one attack roll but automatically hit more than one target.

 

[Prestidigitalis]

I think the ambiguity is from things like Cleave and other attacks that have one attack roll but automatically hit more than one target.

And I think that it comes from powers like Twin Strike, where the term "attack" might refer to the two separate "strikes" or to the entire power as a whole.

 

[Ltheb Silverfrond]

It seems simple enough; I'd agree an attack is when you roll to hit, but there are corner cases where the term 'attack' becomes confusing.

Example:

A warlord in my party has the power Death From Two Sides, which allows himself and an ally to make a melee basic, and "if both attacks hit, the allies' attack is an automatic critical hit." Seems simple, eh? He has a Helm of Heroes, which lets him, as a daily power, grant a standard action instead of a melee basic attack. What happens when he uses both, on the parties' ranger, and the ranger uses a mulit-attack move like twin strike (or if the ranger has heavy blade opportunity and could do it anyway)?

Are both 'attacks' from, say twinstrike, crits? Just the first? What if the ranger was using a power to make 5 attacks? Are they all crits?

 

[Felon]

So, when a half-orc uses his Furious Assault power with a close or area attack, does that increase the damage taken by everyone hit, or just the one enemy who was part of the trigger? Would it retroactively increase damage on everyone hit by the attack prior to using FA?

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

It seems simple enough; I'd agree an attack is when you roll to hit, but there are corner cases where the term 'attack' becomes confusing.

Example:

A warlord in my party has the power Death From Two Sides, which allows himself and an ally to make a melee basic, and "if both attacks hit, the allies' attack is an automatic critical hit." Seems simple, eh? He has a Helm of Heroes, which lets him, as a daily power, grant a standard action instead of a melee basic attack. What happens when he uses both, on the parties' ranger, and the ranger uses a mulit-attack move like twin strike (or if the ranger has heavy blade opportunity and could do it anyway)?

Are both 'attacks' from, say twinstrike, crits? Just the first? What if the ranger was using a power to make 5 attacks? Are they all crits?

The only issue here is that Death from Two Sides doesn't take into account the possibility of multiple attacks. There's no ambiguity about the nature of the word 'attack'. Its simply not specified what happens in this case. Look at the way you asked the question even, you've already accepted the definition of attack by the very way you phrased it. Beyond that even if you used some other definition like 'a power that makes one or more attack rolls' as the definition of 'attack' you would not have clarified the issue because the issue isn't with the definition of attack to start with.

So, when a half-orc uses his Furious Assault power with a close or area attack, does that increase the damage taken by everyone hit, or just the one enemy who was part of the trigger? Would it retroactively increase damage on everyone hit by the attack prior to using FA?

This is also not really an issue of the definition of attack. Its an issue with certain specific powers/feats that comes up with IIRC Destructive Wizardry and multi-attack powers like say Icy Rays. Can a damage bonus be applied retroactively to an attack which has been completed?

In the case of a close or area attack however this is not an issue. It is ONE attack, the PHB clearly states this. There is no 'retroactivity' here because damage is applied to all targets at the same time. Nor would a multi-attack power be an issue here because in that case 'attack' is one target and that's all there is that needs to be said about it, so its a non-issue.

Every single case of this confusion about what attack means can similarly be shown to be either a problem with the interaction of two rules that can't be resolved by any definition of 'attack' or simply a non-issue when you read the rules that define what an attack is.

 

[Prestidigitalis]

So, when a half-orc uses his Furious Assault power with a close or area attack, does that increase the damage taken by everyone hit, or just the one enemy who was part of the trigger? Would it retroactively increase damage on everyone hit by the attack prior to using FA?

Given that the text of the feat Arcane Fury (AP) is "When you use your furious assault racial power to deal extra damage to the target of an area or close arcane power, you deal the extra damage to all targets you hit with the power, not just one.", I would say the answer is clearly no.

 

[kerbarian]

Every single case of this confusion about what attack means can similarly be shown to be either a problem with the interaction of two rules that can't be resolved by any definition of 'attack' or simply a non-issue when you read the rules that define what an attack is.

Where are these rules that define what an attack is?

The ambiguity that comes up all the time in our game is: Does "attack" refer to a single attack roll and its results or to an attack power (which may involve multiple attack rolls and their results)?

For example, from the definition of Melee Attack: "A melee attack against multiple enemies consists of separate attacks, each with its own attack roll and damage roll."

Within that one sentence, they use "attack" both to describe a power that grants multiple attack rolls and to describe the individual attack rolls.

 

[Mort_Q]

Where are these rules that define what an attack is?

This.