What is the D&D of Science Fiction RPGs...

[Erithtotl]

Anyone want to suggest WHY there has never been the grand champion of sci-fi games? I never really understood it.

Perhaps the argument could be made that because sci-fi is inherently forward looking (at its best) its difficult to pick the one set of elements that links all sci-fi together, like Tolkein does for much (not all) of fantasy. The D&D style fantasy inherently has a linkage to historical ideas in it (the medievil setting, etc), that can be used as a basis. Sci-fi has so many sub-genres: Space Opera, Cyberpunk, near-future, Star Wars/Star Trek.

If you go to a book store it looks to me as if sci-fi has approximately equal following with fantasy, at least in shelf-space, and yet the ratio of sci-fi RPG people vs. fantasy RPG playres is rather tilted to fantasy.

Anyway, I played Star Frontiers even before D&D. I'm sure it was crap, but I loved it at the time. It was definitely TSR's attempt to translate D&Ds popularity in space, but it was never that successful. I think there was an overall lack of vision on the product, but there were somethings I really liked about it.

 

[Shadowdancer]

You are not really trying to claim Lucas watched Forbidden Tower and copied the ideas in there, are you?

Well since Lucas himself has said many times he copied the basic story and some of the characters from that movie, then yes, that is exactly what we're saying.

And the movie was called "The Hidden Fortress." It's by Japanese master director Akira Kurosawa. You should watch it sometime. It's really good.

 

[Xeriar]

It is kind of hard to say. Traveller, Shadowrun, Star Wars, Star Trek, Mechwarrior and Warhammer are all settings, immensely popular settings, but still settings.

D&D is mostly a system, though it started as a setting, sure. The only 'system' that's not overshadowed by an order of magnetude is GURPS.

 

[Lalato]

I think that you really have to limit this to games in which space travel is possible.

Games like Cyberpunk and Shadowrun are slightly futuristic, but not classic Sci-Fi.

I also think you should probably exclude games based on TV shows or Movies (Star Wars and Star Trek) because those have become less sci-fi and more pop culture.

Post-Apocalyptic games (Gamma World and others) should probably be excluded too.

Having said that, here is my short list...

•Traveller... hands down is the best and most long lived of the Sci-Fi RPGs.

•Traveller 2300... was silly... never could get into it.

•Star Frontiers... was OK, but no match for Traveller.

•Space Opera... I owned it, but I never actually played it. I made a ton of characters, though... and you can't beat the name: Space Opera.

•Skyrealms of Jorune... never owned it or played it, but it had the most amazing art I've ever seen on a game... simply beautiful.

•Mechwarrior... is simply an extension of the tactical game, Battletech... and in the end everyone I knew would rather play Battletech.

Can't really comment on the other games mentioned in previous posts because I've never heard of them. I wouldn't mind checking them out, though.

 

[Staffan]

In terms of longevity, Traveller.

Given that Traveller has died at least three times so far (Megatraveller, New Era and T4 - I'm not sure if the transition from Classic Traveller to Megatraveller was just an edition change, but I think so), I'm not sure that counts as longevity. There's a difference between serial reincarnation and long life

Though Traveller does seem to have a bit of a revival at the moment, since there are currently three different commercial versions available (Classic, GURPS and T20), and it's said that Marc Miller is working on a T5.

 

[beta-ray]

Not to get too off topic-- and I don't have a suggestion for what the D&D for sci-fi games is-- but what makes you say Traveller 2300 was silly lalato?

Other than the original Traveller books (and maybe that is out of nostalgia), I thought 2300 was a good version of Traveller...

 

[Henry]

Given that Traveller has died at least three times so far (Megatraveller, New Era and T4 - I'm not sure if the transition from Classic Traveller to Megatraveller was just an edition change, but I think so), I'm not sure that counts as longevity. There's a difference between serial reincarnation and long life

Well, to get picky, D&D has had just as many incarnations as Traveller:

D&D
Advanced D&D
Basic D&D
2nd edition AD&D
3rd edition (D&D)

While each one kept the core terms, each one was tweaked somewhat from the previous design, though not quite as much as traveller was. So D&D was been through several "incarntions," itself.


How about GAMMA WORLD/METAMORPHOSIS ALPHA?

 

[Staffan]

Well, to get picky, D&D has had just as many incarnations as Traveller:

D&D
Advanced D&D
Basic D&D
2nd edition AD&D
3rd edition (D&D)

The difference here is that D&D never "died" - the people in charge just thought it was time for a new edition. That's also why I was uncertain about counting CT->Megatraveller as a death for Traveller.

 

[Lalato]

Not to get too off topic-- and I don't have a suggestion for what the D&D for sci-fi games is-- but what makes you say Traveller 2300 was silly lalato?

At the time it was such a departure from the Traveller mythos that I found it completely unplayable. When I bought it I thought it was going to be something akin to the beginnings of the Imperium, but it was something completely different.

The game system itself was OK... (perhaps silly was a little harsh) although I did play a couple of modules, I found myself longing for Traveller and MegaTraveller, instead.

Later it was revealed that Traveller 2300 was never meant to be a "prequel" to Traveller, but a "sequel" to Twilight 2000. That made a lot more sense... and eventually they dropped the Traveller, and just named it 2300 AD.

Had they named it Twilight 2300, I would have probably embraced it a bit more... maybe, possibly... who knows. It was a long time ago.

--sam

 

[Darklance]

I know people are mentioning things like GURPs and Traveller, but, personally, Alternity still holds a place in my heart as the D&D of sci-fi.

Pretty good generic sci-fi rules that really did work well for almost any present day to far future setting. I miss that game.

Those rules still live on with me! I just ran a great game last night. I've even attempted a fantasy game and the rules worked perfectly. Alternity won't die out as long as I live!