What is the least amount of Point Buy you'd play with?

[ARandomGod]

A variant I've seen consists on giving just 6 points to spread on ability modifiers.

So you could, for example, take +4 Str, +1 Dex, +2 Con, +0 Int, +0 Wis, -1 Cha. Which translates to Str 18, Dex 12, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 8.

Then you get to increase three stats by 1 point (of course, you can't increase a 18). In our example, this could become Str 18, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 11, Wis 10, Cha 9.

You know, that's how I've always explained my 'point buy' system, as a mod buy. But recently I played in a group where this one guy just could not grasp the concept. Which was very odd, because he's relatively smart and not intellectually inflexible in other matters...

But for some reason he just couldn't grasp the concept of modifiers, he *needed* it to be in point buy language.

 

[Technik4]

I did not change the module at all and they completed it with thought and creativity, we had some fun encounters. It really isn't that bad of a module.

I never said it was bad, but hard? Did you actually summon those worms which had way underrated CRs? What level were your characters? I'm just astonished, this module tore my PCs to pieces, and they tried to be thoughtful and creative most of the time (they wiped when they should have flee'd, but other than that it was just the tough encounters wrecking them).

Technik

 

[Technik4]

The point was that higher point buy characters will have an easier time unless the DM increases the power of all creatures equally. If that is done, then the high stats of the players become average stats in this case.

Do you think this applies to the above arrays? How much easier of a time will the 36-pt buy array have than the 25-pt buy array?

Technik

 

[Crothian]

I never said it was bad, but hard? Did you actually summon those worms which had way underrated CRs? What level were your characters? I'm just astonished, this module tore my PCs to pieces, and they tried to be thoughtful and creative most of the time (they wiped when they should have flee'd, but other than that it was just the tough encounters wrecking them).

THere level was appripriate for the module, I don't call exactly what it was but I ran them through all of th emods usinjg the average levels. THe worms were a bit tough but they power attacked there way through them.

 

[Crothian]

Do you think this applies to the above arrays? How much easier of a time will the 36-pt buy array have than the 25-pt buy array?

It is really hard to say because stats are just one of many factors one the big ones being luck. But I'd say They can probalby last at least an addition combat session per day, they would hit more often, get hit less, do more damage, have more hit points, have better saves, possibly have more bonus spells.

 

[CRGreathouse]

7 points for Evolution the RPG!? What are you some kind of munchkin? Next you'll be handing out opposable thumbs before people even reach 4th level!

No, 7 points for D&D. That gave 14-9-8-8-8-8, 13-10-8-8-8-8, or 11-10-10-8-8-8. We started as 1st level commoners with 3 random items from the "minor dungeon dressing" table.

 

[Technik4]

But I'd say They can probalby last at least an addition combat session per day, they would hit more often, get hit less, do more damage, have more hit points, have better saves, possibly have more bonus spells.

Respectfully Disagree on most of those counts. For reference:

36 pt array, top 3 scores (other 3 scores):

16, 15, 14 (13, 12, 11)

25 pt array, top 3 scores (other 3 scores):

16, 14, 14 (10, 9, 8)

The 36 pt array fighter will not hit more often, get hit less, do more damage, or have more hit points if those 3 scores are put in Str, Dex, Con. He may have a better Wisdom score, resulting in a slightly higher Will save (biggest spread would be the 36 pt array putting a 12 and the 25 pt array putting an 8: 2 point swing). The same applies to every other class that isn't dependant on more than 3 ability scores (certainly spellcasters will not have more bonus spells, higher DCs, etc).

The biggest differences would be out of combat, as the fighter could have a skill bonus or extra skill points, or be a little charismatic, etc. I do not think these arrays differ by an ECL bonus nor will one significantly outlast the other in combat. The biggest difference is the roleplaying and multiclassing opportunities the higher pt array enables.

Technik

 

[Crothian]

one of the varibles is how the character is going to be assemble and what scores go into what attribute. From other threads people tend to not place their three highest scores in the those for fighters. I said there are lots of varibles here. But a two point bonus to will is a big deal for a fighter.

Well, out of combat can be more important then in combat dependant on the campaign (another varible). I can run a game where the difference between the 2 characters would be nil. I can also run a game where it would be a huge difference.

 

[CRGreathouse]

Respectfully Disagree on most of those counts. For reference:

36 pt array, top 3 scores (other 3 scores):

16, 15, 14 (13, 12, 11)

25 pt array, top 3 scores (other 3 scores):

16, 14, 14 (10, 9, 8)

I'd think most people would put more points into the high/middle stats than the low stats. 16, 16, 16 (12, 9, 8) is also 36 points, yes?

 

[Technik4]

I'd think most people would put more points into the high/middle stats than the low stats.

Sorry, this was bleeding from my other post. I proposed a numer of arrays and was trying to get a vibe for what people thought the gap was between them (They almost all had the same 3 top scores, but the weaker arrays got continually weaker 'low scores' while maintaining the power of the 3 high scores). For reference, I included point buy derivations of the arrays, stressing that an array by its inflexible nature is not as powerful as a typical point buy character. [/hijack]

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