D&D 5E (2014) What is the most powerful spell?

[Yaarel]

Imprisonment 9 is a less well conceived spell. Officially a 9th-level spell, it seems less useful than a 1st-level spell slot.

The purpose of Imprisonment is to trap and hide a hostile, indefinitely, without killing the hostile. The main problem of the spell is, the hostile must be within Close range (30 feet) during its 1-minute casting time. Thus in order to use this spell, the caster must figure out a way to defeat the hostile, keep it immobile for 10 rounds, again without killing it. Even after this extraordinary effort, the hostile gets a saving throw. Moreover, even if the hostile fails the save and becomes imprisoned indefinitely, the fact the hostile remains alive, makes potentially possible the hostile escapes, continues to do harm, seeks revenge, or so on. The utility of the spell remains unclear, nevermind the requirements for casting the spell make the spell itself unnecessary.

If I had a 1st-level spell slot, I would be more likely to spend it on Illusiory Script 1, than use it for Imprisonment 9. That is a painful critique, and surprising for an ostensibly 9th-level spell.

 

[Gadget]

I like this thread as it points out how lacking many of the spells in 5e are, but I think I have a slight difference with the OP in that I don't mind some spells being 'flavor' or 'World-building' or 'Story' spells and not of particular use to the average Adventuring PC. As long as these spells are presented in such a manner that they are not a trap, it does not bother me so much. I would judge the 9th level Imprisonment in this category, as well as the first level Illusory Script . A bit of cool flavor or story ('The Arch Mage McSpellmaster was Imprisoned by the Demon Lord Evil centuries ago...). They do not trouble me nearly as much as, say Weird and Witch Bolt of the corresponding levels due to the fact that these spells seem to be clearly adventuring spells and fall far short in design or implementation (or both).

 

[LizardWizard00]

Thank you for this - I have a hard time picking spells so this is very helpful!

 

[Stalker0]

As long as these spells are presented in such a manner that they are not a trap, it does not bother me so much. I would judge the 9th level Imprisonment in this category, as well as the first level Illusory Script . A bit of cool flavor or story ('The Arch Mage McSpellmaster was Imprisoned by the Demon Lord Evil centuries ago...). They do not trouble me nearly as much as, say Weird and Witch Bolt of the corresponding levels due to the fact that these spells seem to be clearly adventuring spells and fall far short in design or implementation (or both).

I agree with this to a point. I don't mind spells that are more for NPCs than PCs. That said, a spell like imprisonment, with just the right tweak...I think can serve both.

Just remove the saving throw. Its still now an NPC spell for the vast majority of cases. However, if a party wants to go with a 1 minute combat with a super BBEG that they could not defeat normally, with the wizard trying desperately to stay within 30 feet of the BBEG for 10 rounds....I think is immensely awesome. If you accomplish that, screw the save, you earned that imprisonment!

 

[ixthizzar]

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[ixthizzar]

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[Yaarel]

The following spells enjoy alot of consensus: Eldritch Blast 0, Suggestion 2, Forcecage 7, and others.

Fireball 3 seems neck-and-neck with Major Image 3, and Destructive Wave neck-and-neck with Wall Of Force.

 

[Caliban]

The following spells enjoy alot of consensus: Eldritch Blast 0, Suggestion 2, Forcecage 7, and others.

Fireball 3 seems neck-in-neck with Major Image 3.



Wall Of Fire is unable to ‘trap’ enemies.

When you cast it to deal damage, it deals about 20 damage to the area, which is moreorless a 60-foot line. In other words, it seems comparable to 3rd-level Lightning Bolt, maybe slightly less good because of the smaller area than Lightning Bolt.

However, if you cast Wall Of Fire to ‘trap’ enemies, it fails. It only deals damage *if* enemies end their turn in it. Meaning, the enemies can simply walk thru it, without taking damage. No problem.

To benefit from Wall Of Fire as a ‘wall’ requires significant setup to force enemies to end their turns in it, thus situational.

Wall Of Fire seems equivalent to a 3rd-level spell slot, Not Bad, possibly Good.

Reading comprehension failure. Creatures automatically take damage the first time they enter the wall or if they end their turn in the wall, or if the end their turn within 10' of one side of the wall chosen by the caster.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using EN World mobile app

 

[Yaarel]

@Caliban

I was just editing the post when you posted. I am reading from a database, which sometimes has display issues.

 

[Yaarel]

4th level: Wall of Fire. High damage, and the ability to trap a group of enemies of to protect your entire party? I'll take it.

When you cast Wall Of Fire 4 as a damage spell, it deals about 20 damage to the area, moreorless a 60-foot line or a 10-foot radius circle, thus compares roughly to 3rd-level Lightning Bolt.

If the enemies are already in the area and already damaged, they can simply walk out of its area without taking additional damage. In this case, the wall fails to function as a barrier.

As a barrier spell, the 60-foot line can block out sections of a room, hallway, or door. Alternatively, the 10-foot radius can encircle enemies as long as the damaging side of the wall faces outward away from the enemies. In both cases, the use as a barrier deals no damage.

In other words, to cast Wall Of Fire as a ‘trap’ mainly happens if choosing to deal no damage. Instead, the area is a ‘hazard’ that threatens to deal damage in the future if any try to pass thru it.

Note, if the enemies have enough hit points to eat the damage, they can choose to eat it and walk thru the barrier. Thus the barrier is ineffective against powerful enemies.

Note, allies can push enemies into the Wall Of Fire, but reciprocally, enemies can push allies into it. So this use of a hazard seems a wash, unless a setup is in place to make it work.

In sum, Wall Of Fire tends to be either a damage spell or a barrier spell, but less often both. The damage spell is equivalent to a 3rd-level spell slot. So the overall value of the spell depends on how effective this barrier is. Its main use seems to be to keep away a group of enemies that are low hit point or low level, that are less likely to choose to pass thru it or cast or shoot thru it.

Wall Of Fire compares to 3rd-level Good Lightning Bolt as a damage spell. As a barrier spell, it is less good than 4th-level Good Black Tentacles. Thus it seems to rank somewhere from 3rd-level Excellent to 4th-level Not Bad, providing its use as a barrier is worth this.

For now, Wall Of Fire lists as 4th-level Less Useful, in the sense that it is an effective barrier in certain situations.