What the Dorruh are you doing to my Eberron?

[Remathilis]

I was skimming dragon 370 and I found this little nugget lodged in the Design & Development Column

James: We didn’t ever plan to change Eberron the way we changed the Forgotten Realms, but the cosmology ended up being one of the most significant revisions to the world. For all the reasons Rich outlined above, it doesn’t make a lot of sense to create different campaign settings with vastly different cosmological structures. We want Eberron players to be able to buy a book like Manual of the Planes and use it in their games. In 3rd Edition, books like the two Fiendish Codex volumes were very difficult for Eberron players and DMs to use, not just because of Eberron’s changes to the planar cosmology (lacking both a Hell and an Abyss), but because of its changes to demons and devils.
It actually turned out to be a lot easier than I expected to take Eberron’s unusual cosmology and fit it to the universal chassis. You’ll see how it all turned out with the release of the Eberron Campaign Guide this summer, but I’ll give you a teaser. You know how Eberron’s planes all have both names and titles? Like “Kythri, the Churning Chaos” or “Fernia, the Sea of Fire”? Well, how about “Thelanis, the Feywild” or “Dolurrh, the Shadowfell”? Fernia and Risia become regions within the Elemental Chaos, while a lot of other planes are now Astral dominions. We managed not to lose any of the plane names from 3rd Edition Eberron.

AAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!! DO NOT WANT!!!!!!

One of the coolest innovations of 3e was the "multiple multiverses" aspect; Greyhawk had the Wheel, Faerun the Tree, Eberron the Orrery, etc. Similarly, there were no demon-lords or archdevils, there were the Rajah, who were just as powerful BUT tied directly to Eberron. This gave Eberron a unique feel from the traditional planes like the Abyss or Celestia and tied nicely to the 12+1 motif in Eberron (12 planes + Dal Quot).

Now, Eberron is getting slammed with the same old boring cosmology as everyone else; back to the 2e multiverse of everything goes.

Yeah, I can see that its easier to sell books like that (as an Eberron DM, I found no use for FC 1&2 or Drow of the Underdark) but I'm disliking this turn. Eberron's calling card was it was a very unique take on D&D, its looking more and more like the 4e version is going to be "The D&D setting with warforged & choo-choos".

Anyone else afraid 4e Eberron will be as unrecognizable as 4e Realms?

 

[DaveMage]

"Sterilize...imperfections."

 

[Rechan]

Back in 2008, Keith Baker had a live chat. It was asked how they were going to handle the cosmology.

He pointed to the KotS in Eberron article as an example. There, "The Shadowfell" was a place where Dolurrh and Mabar overlapped, and it only was accessable every 60 years.

I think that the 4e Cosmology is getting chopped up and handed around (rather than the Eberron cosmology getting chopped up and handed to the 4e Cosmology). Thelanis (and the other wilderness plane) will get parts of the Feywild. The elemental planes will each get aspects of the Elemental chaos, etc.

Because really, I think that the Eberron designers would be stupid to not use some of the 4e cosmology. 1) 4e cosmology is flehsed out to a degree and the Eberron cosmology isn't. We don't know what any of the planes look like, they haven't been fleshed out at all (and considering that we only get 3 books per setting, they won't. 2) The 4e cosmology (unlike the 3e Cosmology) is inhabitable; the Plane of Fire was just one big fire, rather than Eberron's sea of flame.

Having some overlap and thereby making 4e Cosmology resources available to Eberron DMs is a good thing, imho.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Eberron will be assimilated. There can be no existence of individual identity.

Fear will keep them in line. Fear of this battlestation.

 

[pawsplay]

The idea that the MotP could be interchangeable with any given D&D setting is basically appalling to me.

 

[Ktulu]

The idea that the MotP could be interchangeable with any given D&D setting is basically appalling to me.

And exactly the opposite for me. Saying that this place is "like the feywild" or similar to the "shadowfell" or "in a portion of the astral sea" means I can describe it quicker to newer players and can go about the rest of the story. I don't need 10 different versions of a feywild. I just need one.

 

[Leatherhead]

Wait, isn't this the reason they got rid of the Great Wheel in the first place? So that settings didn't have to conform to each other?

 

[Wormwood]

Having some overlap and thereby making 4e Cosmology resources available to Eberron DMs is a good thing, imho.

As a former Eberron DM, I can happily endorse this statement.

Ditching the Great Wheel (*mouthpuke*) was one of my favorite things about Eberron. Introducing “Thelanis, the Feywild” or “Dolurrh, the Shadowfell” is perfectly fine with me---especially considering 4e's assumptions of tiered play and planar interaction.

 

[ProfessorCirno]

Wait, isn't this the reason they got rid of the Great Wheel in the first place? So that settings didn't have to conform to each other?

Here comes the old boss, same as the new boss.

Wait, no. Great Wheel didn't force itself into every campaign. You had things like...oh say...Eberron.

So I guess, here comes the old boss, worse then the new boss.

In other related news, I'm torn between morning the loss of one of my favorite settings, and laughing inappropriately at the hilarity of I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT I CALLED IT

 

[Fifth Element]

As far as your Eberron goes, if you don't like the changes, don't use them. Beyond that, the designers have a lot more to worry about than your Eberron.