Level Up (A5E) What was taken away from each a5e class?

xiphumor

Explorer
A5e classes can supposedly be run in the same game as O5e classes without balance problems, which means for all the cool stuff that was added, some stuff must have been taken away. Sometimes this is obvious: Fighters lost action surge, Rogues lost their usual expertise, Druids wildshape has fewer uses and is no longer a meat shield, etc. However, I’m having trouble finding what was taken away from other classes. For example, A5e Warlocks just seem like better O5e warlocks with more invocations. Some noteworthy spells were removed from their lists, most notably Hex, but it basically was turned into a subclass feature instead.

Can we make a list of things each class loses compared to their A5e counterpart? If not an exhaustive list, a simple “don’t be surprised when you no longer have X” would suffice.
 

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VeiledMalice

Villager
So far I think it's just Evasion that was taken away from the Monk (now Adept). Realistically, more was added than taken away from that class.
 





I find this odd as a balancing choice seeing as it doesn’t impact you until mid-to-high levels
shrugs Speaking as someone who has played most of the classes, but comes back to the warlock most often, I found it a wonderful balancing decision. IMO, the classes that needed buffs more than they needed revisions (adept and warlock being two examples) got exactly what they needed but with a restrained hand, preventing it from being too much.
 

One thing that I’ve noticed is that the additional exploration and social features are just extra. The balance seems to be intended based primarily on the combat features in O5e and A5e (and what few exploration features were included in O5e design).

That being said, I do have that all figured out in a spreadsheet and I can hopefully get it into a format you might find useful later this week. You may have to remind me.
 

One thing that I’ve noticed is that the additional exploration and social features are just extra. The balance seems to be intended based primarily on the combat features in O5e and A5e (and what few exploration features were included in O5e design).

That being said, I do have that all figured out in a spreadsheet and I can hopefully get it into a format you might find useful later this week. You may have to remind me.

I'd be interested in seeing this spreadsheet.

One of the areas that isn't obvious by looking strictly at class features though are the spell changes.

The Wizard seems to have a bunch of extra class features in A5e without losing many O5e class features, but some spells have been nerfed. The extra stuff is pretty good, so my hunch is that the Wizard actually became more powerful in A5e but you'd have to do a more comprehensive assessment of the spell changes to be sure.
 

Keep something else in mind as you're compiling: certain things (like the aforementioned Hex spell) were removed in whole or in part not as a balancing or design decision but because they're not designated as open content by WotC. There were plenty of conscious design decisions (pulling action surge, making Second Wind a maneuver, making Eldritch Blast a class feature, not keying Divine Smite off of spell slots, and so on) but you may want to check a copy of the O5E SRD as you're going. It'll prove illuminating.
 

Xethreau

Josh Gentry - Author, Minister in Training
Warlocks lost Mystic Arcanum (access to 6th, 7th, 8th, and 9th level spells). You now have to spend an Invocation on each one.
It is worth noting that A5e warlocks gain invocations to compensate, allowing you either to learn a spell per arcanum OR chose another powerful ability. Clever warlocks of high level will also train away lower-level invocations to gain all the powerful ones.
 

Here's the spreadsheets. The first sheet is a direct side-by-side listing of the features of each O5e class (including the bonus features from Tasha's Cauldron of Everything). The second sheet is an attempt to use A5e classes to replicate O5e classes as closely as possible by means of optional feature selections. Other than simply giving the O5e ranger the additional class features from Tasha's Cauldron of Everything that were supposed to be swapped for PHB, I think it should be free of house rules.

I put a simple color-coded key at the top of each sheet, but some of the classes (like fighter) have additional abbreviations that aren't described but can probably be figured out from context (ie, AS = number of action surges per short rest, and SW = amount of healing from SW).

I included the file in .xlsx and .ods formats.
 

Attachments

  • O5e to A5e Class Comparisons.zip
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