What're good PrCs for a Warmage?

[cignus_pfaccari]

So, I'll be joining an al-Qadim game soon, and the party's short on artillery. The primary arcane caster is a sha'ir, who apparently doesn't prepare much in the way of combat spells, and he's backed up by an arcane trickster. So, since the other roles are filled, I figured I'd try out a warmage. This'll be the first time I've played an arcane caster, since I can't plan worth a darn and I don't like being so massively fragile. However, nuking the opposition is fairly straightforward, and I figure tossing fireballs can't be too hard.

Currently, DM's having me start at 10th level, and those have been filled out as Wmg 8/Pal 2 (in an obvious Divine Grace grab). Unfortunately, warmage loses its appeal after 8th level, since all you really get are a bunch of Sudden feats. So, I went PrC shopping, and found that there aren't many, or any, 10-level PrCs I can go into, at least in the WotC books I have. Many of those require spells that I just don't have. I'm looking for spellcasting in most, if not all of the levels, and nifty things to do.

Current plans are to take 1-2 levels of Spellblade for the SF reduction (since Armored Mage doesn't apply to shields) and possibly for bonus feat, 1 level of Arcane Devotee for the Reach of the Holy ability, 5 levels of War Wizard, and, in between this, a couple of levels of Havoc Mage, finishing that in epic levels. I may then go in for Eldritch Knight.

I am taking Practiced Spellcaster so I at least keep up some oomph on my spells. Other feats include Mounted Combat, Mounted Archery (1st level), Mounted Casting (3rd), and Improved Edge (9th). I'm strongly tempted to drop Mounted Casting and replace it with Combat Casting, to position myself for more conventional PrCs. I'm also sorely tempted to take Improved Initiative, so I can lay the smack down on the opposition faster.

Yes, this has obnoxiously good Fort and Will saves, but I've mentioned that to the DM and he has no issue with it. Heck, he suggested Spellblade. What I'm looking for, from y'all, are other appropriate PrCs that I can take, either WotC ones that I missed, or reasonable third-party ones. I'm particularly interested in that Mesos class that Nightfall mentioned...

Ideas? Thanks in advance!

Brad

 

[Chun-tzu]

By War Wizard, I assume you mean the War Wizard of Cormyr? That's a good choice. The Raumathari Battlemage from Unapproachable East is pretty decent for any kind of battle mage, as well.

Archmage is always a good choice for artillerists, except it's tougher for the Warmage to qualify than Wizards or Sorcerers. An Archmage needs spells of level 5+ from 5 different schools, and the Warmage's are mostly evocation. He also has conjuration, transmutation, and necromancy at levels 5-7, but doesn't get a high level illusion spell until 16th level, when he can cast 8th level spells. That leaves only 4 levels for Archmage before epic levels.

The Mage Killer is nice for battle mages. Boosting your Fort and Reflex saves is not a bad idea, even with your Paladin levels. The odd thing is, the class seems to have been re-made as the Halruaan Magehound in Shining South, and it loses a few spellcasting levels. But the classes are different enough that you could still have the Mage Killer PrC as separate from the Magehound. In other words, ask your DM

There's a good 5-level battle mage PrC in Dragonlance: Age of Mortals, called, >sigh< the War Mage (cf. Warmage). You get ASF reductions (like the Spellsword) and some other nice abilities, but it would HAVE to be renamed.

 

[Judas]

By War Wizard, I assume you mean the War Wizard of Cormyr?

No, he means Warmage. It's one of the new core classes first listed in Minitures handbook, then updated slightly in Complete Arcane. Basically it's a sorcerer that can cast in armor, with no ASF. The Warmage spell list is even tighter than the Sorcerer, and the only new spells he can learn have to be evocations.

Cignus, what armor are you using? Mithral Breastplate is a good choice. Since you mention Paladin, if you have access to the Dracomnicon, you may want to gander at the Dracolyte. At 10th level you can summon an Adult Dragon to fight by your side for 10 rounds.

 

[Chun-tzu]

No, he means Warmage. It's one of the new core classes first listed in Minitures handbook, then updated slightly in Complete Arcane.

Actually, I was referring to his third paragraph, where he talks about taking War Wizard for 5 levels. I'm familiar with the Warmage

 

[Storyteller01]

The Battlemage from Mongoose Pub. is great, but you won't be able to touch it until 11th level (skill restrictions).

Basically, fire multiple spells in one casting, as well as cast spells per the AD&D fighters attack progression (3 spells per 2 rounds). Tends to eat up spells per day EXTREMELY fast though.

The book also has the Eldritch swordsman. Essentially, you cast spells by attacking with a sword as the final component (true attacks, not touch attacks. Spells aren't wasted if you miss). It's the only way you can cast them, but you're immune to your own area effect spells. You gain a magic sword and robe, both of which use sacrificed spells to soak hit point damage or improve combat. Again, you gain the ability to cast several spells at once, as well as the improved spell casting progression, but you'll be using spells so quickly that if you are in combat more than once per adventure, your toast...

Mongoose also has the Artillerist PrC for sorcerers (in, of all things, The Quintessential Sorcerer!! ). The big bonuses are that in later levels 1) metamagic doesn't increase the spell casting times (so now Quicken Spell is possible), 2) immunity to your own direct damage causing spells, and 3) the ability to pass that immunity to members of your party!

Of course, there is the 'Reignite' ability at 10th level (sacrifice a spell slot of equal or higher level to reignite a spell cast last round. Only does half damage, but it only takes a move equivalent action to do). With Quicken spell, you can cast 3 spells per round, but it will eat up your spells for the day

 

[Judas]

Actually, I was referring to his third paragraph, where he talks about taking War Wizard for 5 levels. I'm familiar with the Warmage

Oops.. Skipped that line apparently.. sorry.

 

[Gaiden]

The Battlemage from Mongoose Pub. is great, but you won't be able to touch it until 11th level (skill restrictions).

Basically, fire multiple spells in one casting, as well as cast spells per the AD&D fighters attack progression (3 spells per 2 rounds). Tends to eat up spells per day EXTREMELY fast though.

The book also has the Eldritch swordsman. Essentially, you cast spells by attacking with a sword as the final component (true attacks, not touch attacks. Spells aren't wasted if you miss). It's the only way you can cast them, but you're immune to your own area effect spells. You gain a magic sword and robe, both of which use sacrificed spells to soak hit point damage or improve combat. Again, you gain the ability to cast several spells at once, as well as the improved spell casting progression, but you'll be using spells so quickly that if you are in combat more than once per adventure, your toast...

Mongoose also has the Artillerist PrC for sorcerers (in, of all things, The Quintessential Sorcerer!! ). The big bonuses are that in later levels 1) metamagic doesn't increase the spell casting times (so now Quicken Spell is possible), 2) immunity to your own direct damage causing spells, and 3) the ability to pass that immunity to members of your party!

Of course, there is the 'Reignite' ability at 10th level (sacrifice a spell slot of equal or higher level to reignite a spell cast last round. Only does half damage, but it only takes a move equivalent action to do). With Quicken spell, you can cast 3 spells per round, but it will eat up your spells for the day

The eldrich swordsman sounds like the perfect PrC for a character of mine. What book is it in?

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

From the looks of things, I'd say you need to figure out what you want the character to do: do you want to cast spells that blow things up or do you want to be able to hit things with weapons and hurt them? Because right now, the classes you're discussing are all over the map.

The straight up fact is that, in 3.x D&D, a warrior/wizard who loses caster levels is not going to be nearly as effective a spellslinger as a straight-up wizard who hasn't lost any caster levels. As a paladin/warmage, you're already casting 2 levels behind a wizard (one level of spells lower, etc), practiced spellcaster or no. If you take more than one level of spellsword, you get some nifty abilities, but you fall even further behind. Havoc Mage does the same thing.

The same is true for fighting. With 8 levels of warmage, you're guaranteed to have a lower base attack bonus than a cleric until 16th level--even if you don't take any more classes that sacrifice BAB. And, unlike the cleric (or a real sorcerer/wizard) you don't have spells like Divine Power to make up for it. (Heck, you don't even get Tenser's Transformation, False Life, Heroism, and most of the other spells that work well for traditional fighter/wizards).

So, if your goal is to be the party artillery, you should absolutely refuse to take any classes that don't improve your spellcasting ability at every level. With two levels of paladin, you've lost as much as you can afford to lose--probably more. If your goal is to be a fighter who uses magic to hit stuff harder and hurt it more, you need to make sure that you don't lose any more base attack bonus than you already have. In fact, you've probably already lost too much and should consider going down to Pal 2/Warmage 6/Spellsword 1/Eldritch Knight 1. (Actually, you should consider going to sorcerer instead of warmage since the sorcerer spells have a lot more synergy with fighting than the warmage spells).

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

From the looks of things, I'd say you need to figure out what you want the character to do: do you want to cast spells that blow things up or do you want to be able to hit things with weapons and hurt them? Because right now, the classes you're discussing are all over the map.

Hrm...you know, you're right!

His primary specialty would be artillery, and secondary would be ranged combat. I'd sooner drop fireballs on myself than willingly engage in melee combat, with his Str of 10.

I put in Havoc Mage because I was initially going for more of a fighter-mage, from a previous version of the concept. However, being able to shoot an arrow and toss a spell isn't worth it, probably. Alright, time to take that out.

Raumathari Battlemage, unfortunately, is kind of too sword-focused for me. I'll have to check out that Dragonlance class, since my DM has the books. I don't think Mage-Killer and Archmage are going to work, due to the gigundous pre-requisites. I doubt the DM will go for that Battlemage class.

Armor was going to be a mithral BP, but instead it'll be mithral lamellar.

Anything else I missed? Anything from Dragon? I'm going through my issues, but can't find anything useful. Thanks, guys!

Brad

 

[Storyteller01]

The eldrich swordsman sounds like the perfect PrC for a character of mine. What book is it in?

Battle Magic from Mongoose Publishing. Look in the Encyclopedia Arcana section on-line. There is a catch. Your BAB doesn't improve (your stuck with the +1 to BAB every 2 levels), so your reliant on sacrificing spells to improve your chance to hit. You don't lose spell casting levels though.

Guess you better start aiming at rocks instaed of living targets! ;p