When and why were the factions driven out of Sigil?

[Silverblade The Ench]

I liked Planescape, not as much as some other settings but it was good and had a real charm, it made connecting D&D's multiverse easy to imagine.

The factions in Sigil and beyond, were part of this.
When and where did they get driven out? I know it happened from several bits of lore in 3rd ed and 4th. Must have been a module I missed?

Personally, I'd like to keep them as if that had never occured, as they made the multiverse much more interesting, as I loved the idea that "belief" is what's important and thus, groups grow up about that, plus it gives very needed factions for adventures to "Bounce off" from, or against or with.

The factions themselves were prety interesting

 

[Glyfair]

The factions in Sigil and beyond, were part of this.
When and where did they get driven out? I know it happened from several bits of lore in 3rd ed and 4th. Must have been a module I missed?

I'm sure a Planescape expert will reply soon. IIRC, it was in a late module (Faction War?).

Also, apparently Monte Cook has gone on the record as saying a later module was going to have them back in, but it never got published.

 

[Bumbles]

If you don't mind the potential spoilers, there's a whole article here on the Faction War.

 

[FireLance]

Towards the end of the 2e product cycle, there was an edition war and the moderator perma-banned them.

More seriously, though:

Yes, there was a module called Faction War (which could actually be turned into an edition war if you "edit" the "fact" ), and in the course of the module, the factions openly fought each other in Sigil. In the aftermath, some factions were dissolved, others merged, or split, or moved their headquarters out of Sigil, but all of them gave up their role in the day-to-day running of Sigil.

What this means is that you can still have characters and NPCs espousing the beliefs of any of the factions (even the disbanded ones - such people may even be trying to re-establish the faction with others that have similar beliefs). You can still have faction-related plots and schemes. People who belong to (official) factions are still allowed to enter Sigil. The factions have just lost the political clout that they used to have.

 

[Silverblade The Ench]

Thanks folks!

hm, I know D&D lore isn't stationary, but...yet another time I think TSR threw the baby out with the bath water :/

The rivalries of the factions before this wipe out seem much more fun?

As for edition wars, hehe, that "Faction War" I think did 4th ed a disservice by relegating the factions to small fry.
For D&D play to thrive, their has ot be opposition and factions to work off.
Law vs Chaos was a damned good one that got lost, for example to the detriment of the game, so maruts are now just "collecting favours"...eh?!
Ah well *hugs his Planescape boxed etc*

 

[Shemeska]

"This city no longer tolerates your faction. Abandon it or die." - Her Serenity

The factions that survived the Faction War are still around, but they no longer hold "official" political power in Sigil itself. Many of them are more focused on gaining power across the planes at large, some wield influence through the now resurgent guilds (that the factions themselves replaced centuries before), etc.

Things are just more complex and cut-throat than perhaps they were before, and a number of inviduals in Sigil like Estevan, Zadara, Shemeska, and Jeremo are all now more important and powerful as oligarchs within the city than ever before.

 

[Dausuul]

Thanks folks!

hm, I know D&D lore isn't stationary, but...yet another time I think TSR threw the baby out with the bath water :/

Yeah, one of TSR's big weaknesses was the tendency to produce a good setting with a cool hook, then completely trash that setting in modules/novels, and treat the content of those modules/novels as an established part of the universe from there on out. If they'd stuck to WotC's new model of "three books per setting and we're done," everybody would have been so much better off.

Not that I'm bitter about Dark Sun or anything...

 

[Shemeska]

If they'd stuck to WotC's new model of "three books per setting and we're done," everybody would have been so much better off.

And we wouldn't have a tenth of the flavor and detail in those settings if they had. TSR could do setting support, something WotC isn't doing remotely near the levels of 2e or even a fraction of what we had for 3e.

 

[an_idol_mind]

And we wouldn't have a tenth of the flavor and detail in those settings if they had. TSR could do setting support, something WotC isn't doing remotely near the levels of 2e or even a fraction of what we had for 3e.

There's probably a healthy balance that should have been struck. While TSR's flavor was great, they tended to wreck their settings way too often. For example, Dark Sun didn't make it out of its first novel series without the world being torn apart. Big events like that should probably have been saved for edition changes or the like, rather than getting shoved out within the first two years of a setting's lifespan.

 

[Nymrohd]

TSR also trashed every single setting they created. They Faction War'd Planescape, Pristine Tower'd Dark Sun, Vecna'd Ravenloft, brought down a cataclysm on Dragonlance and killed half a dozen gods in Toril, decided Oerth needed it's own world war . . . did they do anything to Spelljammer?