When/If should Prestige Classes be introduced?

[Mostlyjoe]

After picking up the APG when it came out I loved the archtypes for their ease at simulating specalites in each of the class with out requireing vastly different base attack math, or much in the way of diminishing returns. The few additional Prestige Classes seem to fit the same roles the core book ones do: Advanced Specialization, Hybrid class builds.

It made me think. When whould a new Prestige Classes come into play at all? They often mean giving up capstone abilities to get more short term bonuses, but grant the player rarer play options. And yes, I can't help but thinking that most/all of this should be handled by Archtypes in play.

So besides say a Adventure Path/setting Prestige Class and very specific hybrid/specializations when do you think a Prestige Class should come into play? Or should they completely focus on Archtypes?

 

[Crothian]

I like the archetypes much better the prestige classes. I would not be unhappy if prestige classes went away completely.

 

[Psion]

In addition to hybridizing classes, I feel as if a class concept is built entirely around a narrow ability or shtick, it should be a PRC.

To this end, I think the summoner would have been better off as a PRC. You can already play a conjuration specialist; the only thing that distinguishes the summoner is the eidolon.

 

[gamerprinter]

There are just some builds that can't be done effectively without prestige classes. Right now, the party I'm running, the rogue took a level in Assassin. He's evil and has multiclassed into Sorcerer/Rogue, which means he'll never get the rogue's capstone power. So by taking a level in Assassin, he gains Death Attack. He doesn't plan to take any more levels in Assassin as that was the only 'skill' he wanted and wanted early.

All the other players are running single class characters, but already some of the others are starting to look at various PrC for possible options. While I personally like the 'go with a single class' use some APG goodness for variety and shoot for the capstone power - this mentality isn't universal in my group, and I see no reason to push my preference onto them.

So I too would never want to see Prestige Classes nixed for whatever reason. There should always be options and not restricted options.

GP

PS: hows it going, MostlyJoe? - first time I've noticed you on ENWorld...

 

[IronWolf]

I like the archetypes much better the prestige classes. I would not be unhappy if prestige classes went away completely.

This is along the lines of what I think. Making base classes more customizable by being able to trade one option for another seems like a clean system for me and leaves me with the ability to have a highly customizable character.

We might still need some more APG type books along the way to completely lose the prestige classes, but I would not be sad to see them go.

 

[Votan]

This is along the lines of what I think. Making base classes more customizable by being able to trade one option for another seems like a clean system for me and leaves me with the ability to have a highly customizable character.

We might still need some more APG type books along the way to completely lose the prestige classes, but I would not be sad to see them go.

Me neither; I like options (a lot) but fear that the prestige class system went from being a "special way to make a character special" to an :advanced class system". It's one of those ideas that is very cool in conception but seems to lead to more problems in practice than one would expect.

 

[BryonD]

I think they are different tools that do different jobs.

PClasses have been used poorly many times in the past, but they are excellent when used correctly.

Archetypes are also cool. The game with either would be less than the game with both.

 

[Mostlyjoe]

I think they are different tools that do different jobs.

PClasses have been used poorly many times in the past, but they are excellent when used correctly.

But when are they used correctly? Got some good examples?

 

[gamerprinter]

I've got my assassin example, above. What if you want to make a Gish, going with Eldritch Wizard? None of the base classes are very gish like. Both Dwarven Defender and Arcane Archer gives extra flavor to those nonhuman races - people like to play those kinds of characters. Why deny anyone variety, just because the APG makes the base classes much more inviting.

Variety is variety and has always been the strength 3x - so why curtail that in anyway in Pathfinder. While I don't usually play PrC, I don't see a good reason to remove them from the game.

Keep in mind that PF has currently nerfed the PrC a bit, so the brokeness of 3x prestige classes don't quite fit the PF mold. So if you disliked the broken prestige classes of 3x, you can expect a big difference with any PrC in PF.

GP

 

[ffanxii4ever]

But when are they used correctly? Got some good examples?

In just about every situation where a PC takes a single prestige class for its entire length, and not when they just take a level or two of it for one or two abilities. Granted, 3.5 didn't help any by releasing PrC's like the Exotic Weapon Master, where the entire point of the class is just to make you a less generic fighter by giving all sorts of different tricks.