When is it no longer heroic fantasy?

[Jason Kain]

Hello all. I'm in a rough spot with my DM, and I'm looking for some advice. I currently hold the record for most characters killed by him, for two reasons: First, I don't build for the sake of being optimal, I try to build to be interesting to me. Second, I lose interest in the character I'm playing fairly quickly.

I finally realized why for both reasons today: I can't find any bit of "heroic" in the heroic fantasy game. I can summarize the last three campaigns I've played with him as DM with one plotline. There's a big evil about to take over the world, and there's nothing you can do to stop it. Once we were involved in "battling" pit fiends and balors at level three. Then we were placed against a full on army at level five in the next campaign. Finally, the latest has us "fighting" vampires. We're level one. The reason for the quotations is that we never actually do any fighting. We're expected to run away, and are told as much. The fighting we do is never actually connected to the big evil in the world, we're just reminded of how inferior we are whenever they show up.

The thing is, it's not because he's trying to make us feel inferior mechanically. He does everything he can to boost us mechanically...in his own way. He feels giving us trinket abilities makes up for it...whether we want them or not. This was the second campaign in a row where I went in with a character concept he knew about and liked beforehand, but the trinket ability he rolled was completely opposed to...and I was supposed to accept the roll and play my character as such.

Finally, the big part of no heroism: Nothing we do works. Ever. If we try something he didn't plan for, we're told no. NPCs serve no purpose other than to be kidnapped and killed while we watch. Today, I had the chance to save 2 NPCs from the clutches of death. Do you know what happened? The first I rescued, and brought to the doctor. The doctor declares him to have an incurable disease and decapitates him. The second I didn't even get the chance to try and save. I run out, distract the two monsters using her as bait, and four more monsters drop down from the roofs and, I quote, "rip her to shreds before you can even move." That character died...basically by suicide. Vampires invaded the streets, and he didn't take shelter, he decided to take as many out as he could. The last character in the previous campaign? Died because there was no way around three consecutive traps in a hallway. The previous character in that campaign? Died in battle because he refused to retreat. The previous character? Eaten by two monsters in his third round of being alive, first of being attacked.

Don't get me wrong, he's a great storyteller and a great friend, but I just have a hard time stomaching this brand of D&D. Is there something wrong with me? Am I not seeing something I should be? I admit tragedy can be a powerful tool, but when the first five minutes of the campaign can be summarized into "Doom is coming and there's nothing you can do about it", is it wrong to feel no attachment to the pile of numbers that's about to be replaced? Is it wrong to feel no investment in a world with no hope?

Is it even heroic fantasy anymore?

 

[jdrakeh]

Sounds like your DM is a complete tool who is only concerned with realizing his own vision, to the point that he won't let the players do or try anything that may contradict it. Time to find a new DM, I say. You clearly aren't having any fun, and that's what I assume you're into roleplaying for in the first place. Right?

Now, having said that, I realize that your DM is probably a cool guy to hang out with away from the table. . . I've been in that position, myself, though not for a number of years. I had a very good friend whom I enjoyed spending time with outside of gaming -- but man, gaming brought out the worst in him. He was a selfish, unbearable, at the game table.

This situation sucks and, IME, there is no easy way out of it. If you tell him you're not having fun with his Killer DM approach to D&D, he'll probably take it personally (my friend did, at least). The good news is that if he considers you as much of a friend as you do he, the hurt will be relatively short-lived.

[Edited for content.]

 

[Aus_Snow]

Reads like an inexplicably amusing parody of roleplaying. . . well, it would if it wasn't for the fact that you and other players are actually living it. So, maybe not (amusing.)

Control issues, or something along those lines. Did the DM get burned back when by some big bad uh, DM? Their brother or sister, perhaps? Hm, let's psych this. Nah, j/k.

Sorry to hear things are going so crap. Hope you find a solution.

 

[Jason Kain]

It's a rough situation, because he's all I really have to game with. It's him and one other friend. The other player is in a slightly different boat than I am. He doesn't care. The most enthusiasm he shows is when dealing with the stupid "no" Npcs that get put in our path, or before a monster is revealed. Mainly because he can quote movies and TV shows to completely rip apart the atmosphere that's being created. Completely in character. The guy doesn't even know how to play, and he won't take it seriously, because it's just that...repetitive.

Myself? Lately I've found most of my fun comes from harassing the DM through his Npcs. For instance...area attacks with random Npcs in the line of fire. Or throwing the random "no" Npcs into things. The latest two were the best. First we had a guy in a bar stand up and say "That's it, I'm tired of nothing happening!", and nothing else. This was after a ten minute stretch of nothing out of us, as we were set in a town with no hooks, no motivation, no anything. I hit him in the face with a barstool and said "Exciting enough for you?" Turns out he was the mayor's son.

The next was the innkeeper, who refused to open the thick iron grate in front of the door so we could try to save the earlier mentioned "Ripped to shreds" Npc. I intimidated him, succeeded, and he still wouldn't open the door. So I threw him into it from across the room, following through on my threat. Apparently I was supposed to just go around him and pull the lever...that I didn't know about.

So, on the one hand, we're semi-happy. We entertain ourselves by playing opposition to the DM whenever possible. However, we're really not happy, as we're trying to actually...be heroic, and not giant idiots to the townsfolk. It's just really hard when they're all against you.

 

[Sanguinemetaldawn]

Is it even heroic fantasy anymore?

Nothing is wrong with it, you are just playing Call of Cthulhu.

But seriously, you should demand that your DM run a Cthulhu game. Thats basically what he is doing. I think transferring the mentality to a ruleset that is designed to support that style of gameplay, and being exposed to scenarios that work based on the assumptions he uses will make him a better DM of that style.

My recommendation: Delta Green

 

[TheAuldGrump]

'I'm not running a game! I'm telling a story!'

Trust me, I have encountered GMs like that before....

Avoid when possible. Gnawing off your own limbs in order to escape, while a tad extreme, is an acceptable method of dealing with the problem.

If you are having less fun than you would while reading a book then either 1. quit the game (and find another if possible) or 2. Oust him as GM and run it yourself. (A bad DM was how I got my start, after we kicked him out.)

The Auld Grump, who wishes that he had more helpful advice.

*EDIT* Actually, having him run CoC isn't a bad idea.

 

[haakon1]

That sounds bad. I've played with a DM whose styles is different from mine (he's hack and slash with NPCs only to be killed, I like atmosphere and NPC's who are there to live), and I've enjoyed it, but found something lacking.

You could try talking to DM about what you want.

You could also try DMing yourself. Your friend the DM would probably like to play -- most DM's do -- and you might learn from each other.

 

[DrunkonDuty]

I remember being stuck in games like this when I was 13, 14. The DM was a nice guy, but a lousy DM. Tell your friend you're not happy. Hell, point him to your post here, it's quite clear. ASk him to change. Honestly it really does sound like it's entirely his bad style. If things don't change might time to think about finding another group. WHich sounds like it may not be an easy option for you.

Just remember it's a game, everyone's friends and the object is for everyone to have fun. Yourself included.

 

[Jason Kain]

Thanks for the kind words, everybody. It means a lot. I just wanted to get a quick few words in about me DMing...

I do/did. We have a revolving DM seat, where each person gets a campaign. Mine just...well, kind of fell apart as we never got a chance to play, and most players left for college/military. Today was the start of his turn.

 

[Morrus]

Sounds to me that what he really wants to do is write a gritty survival horror novel, rather than run a D&D campaign.