Where 3E and 4E players stand in the great 3E disputes

[Starbuck_II]

Before this gets started, this isn't an attempt at yet another edition wars thread. I'm just wondering where fans of the different games stand in regards to the classic disputes between 3E players. This isn't a knock on 3E, as these were issues that were discussed to no end between 3E players before 4E was ever announced. I'm curious to see where people playing either edition fall in terms of the old 3E discussions

So here is the questionaire:

1. Psionics: Good or Bad?

Better than good, it's Log!
But yes, very good. Better than sex good.

2. Tome of Battle: The antichrist or best thing that ever happened?

Not best thing ever, but pretty great. Last DM didn't allow it because it breaks the old paradigm.

If I ever play a 3E game again (need a new DM as I am DM less) than I want to try one of them.

3. Fighter Sux: Yes or No?

Suck compared to some other classes, yes. Worthless no.
Really, I blame learning experience (after PHB 2, Fighters were decent), but it was too late to save their marriage.

4. Wizard and CoDzilla overpowered to the point of game disruption: yes or no?
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Depends on player...well except druid, Natural spell is almost a no brainer.

5. Your 3E games: Rules as written or houseruled into oblivion?

RAW as much as possible but occasional rule is needed (mostly spells).

6. Does your group optimize, or play more casually?

I say semi-optimize: a little casual but not without thinking of what would character do (optimize some).

7. Eberron: Yes or No?

Never played, but would welcome a chance.

8. Do you currently play more 3E, or 4E?(this question is to see where each group falls in terms of the previous questions)


If I missed any of these, let me know an I can add them later.

More 4E as I am DMing it when I have school break.

Haven't played D&D in months...I'm getting withdrawals...

 

[Man in the Funny Hat]

1. Psionics: Good or Bad?

Meh. I don't mind psionics and in some ways I LIKE the flavor it gives to a campaign, but I really haven't much cared for any implementation of it in any edition.

2. Tome of Battle: The antichrist or best thing that ever happened?

Never even read it so, don't know and more importantly - don't CARE.

3. Fighter Sux: Yes or No?

No.

4. Wizard and CoDzilla overpowered to the point of game disruption: yes or no?

No.

5. Your 3E games: Rules as written or houseruled into oblivion?

Very much RAW. Houserules are fairly few and superficial.

6. Does your group optimize, or play more casually?

These are not mutually exclusive concepts. A certain amount of "optimization" is sensible and to be expected. That said, however, we do NOT make any kind of science out of it and the idea of "builds" rather than just "characters" is quite different from our style. In that sense it makes us fairly casual.

7. Eberron: Yes or No?

Meh. Read it and liked some parts and cared nothing for other parts. Have not run it or played in it as a setting and won't. It serves largely as a mine for ideas.

8. Do you currently play more 3E, or 4E?(this question is to see where each group falls in terms of the previous questions)

3.5 was the last edition I played. I have not yet played 4E but would like to give it a try - as a PLAYER, not as DM (as DM I just do not grok it in the least.) The next game I run will be 1E-based but given the type and number of houserules that would be applied will look a fair amount like 2E.

 

[mlund]

I figure by answering before reading the thread I'd provide my most honest gut reactions:

So here is the questionaire:

1. Psionics: Good or Bad?

Bad

2. Tome of Battle: The antichrist or best thing that ever happened?

Meh, the Crusader is a little out of control, but I like where it was headed.

3. Fighter Sux: Yes or No?

Indeed, the fighters sucked.

4. Wizard and CoDzilla overpowered to the point of game disruption: yes or no?

Good grief, YES - and I favored playing casters myself.

5. Your 3E games: Rules as written or houseruled into oblivion?

3.5 with RAW

6. Does your group optimize, or play more casually?

Generally optimized.

7. Eberron: Yes or No?

No.

8. Do you currently play more 3E, or 4E?(this question is to see where each group falls in terms of the previous questions)

More 4E

- Marty Lund

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

1. Psionics: Good or Bad?
GOOD - though there are some balance issues.

2. Tome of Battle: The antichrist or best thing that ever happened?
MEH - though it has some interesting bits, and to be fair I don't own the book.

3. Fighter Sux: Yes or No?
NO - I think fighters are very customizable, and can be very, very effective.

4. Wizard and CoDzilla overpowered to the point of game disruption: yes or no?
NO - but I'm not an over-optimizer, nor are most of my players.

5. Your 3E games: Rules as written or houseruled into oblivion?
RAW, more or less - but I feel comfortable ruling by fiat when I feel the need.

6. Does your group optimize, or play more casually?
CASUAL

7. Eberron: Yes or No?
YES - I like it, but I never played in the setting. I use bits of it, as does one other DM in our rotation.

8. Do you currently play more 3E, or 4E?(this question is to see where each group falls in terms of the previous questions)
3E.

 

[ejja_1]

My 2 coppers

1. Psionics: Neither I or my players really had intrest in it.

2. Tome of Battle: Never heard of it... Most of our games are core only.

3. Fighter Sux: Even at Lv 10 the fighter in the group has the highest body count in one round and the record for most damage dished out, although the Wizard is right there with him and will deffinately surpass him soon im sure.

4. Wizards have always had that weak at low level, insanely powerfull at high levels thing. kind of the trade of for being such a wuss for so many of the beginning levels. Not sure about CoDzilla, other than it sounds like a large fish that destroys Tokyo.....

5. Your 3E games: Straight out of the books, with the occasional rule zero for unusual situations.

6. Does your group optimize, or play more casually? Both depending on what the players want out of the game.

7. Eberron: Looks like a cool kinda steam punk like game, but thats not what my group is looking for.

8. Do you currently play more 3E, or 4E? 3.5 Ive played a couple of 4e games but not enough to really get a feel for it. The combat was ok, depending on the class you played. The games we played really didnt have much backstory or roleplaying involved, or at least the dm's didnt concentrate on it much......

 

[Invisible Stalker]

Before this gets started, this isn't an attempt at yet another edition wars thread. I'm just wondering where fans of the different games stand in regards to the classic disputes between 3E players. This isn't a knock on 3E, as these were issues that were discussed to no end between 3E players before 4E was ever announced. I'm curious to see where people playing either edition fall in terms of the old 3E discussions

So here is the questionaire:

1. Psionics: Good or Bad?

2. Tome of Battle: The antichrist or best thing that ever happened?

3. Fighter Sux: Yes or No?

4. Wizard and CoDzilla overpowered to the point of game disruption: yes or no?

5. Your 3E games: Rules as written or houseruled into oblivion?

6. Does your group optimize, or play more casually?

7. Eberron: Yes or No?

8. Do you currently play more 3E, or 4E?(this question is to see where each group falls in terms of the previous questions)


If I missed any of these, let me know an I can add them later.

1. Hell no, banned from any game I DM since 1e
2. Never bought it or used it
3. No, but it is the least favorite of the martial classes
4. No
5. very few houserules
6. more casual than min/max
7. Eberron? don't like the setting and never purchased a book
8. 4E

 

[Masquerade]

1. Psionics: Good or Bad?

In 3e, bad; in 3.5, good.

2. Tome of Battle: The antichrist or best thing that ever happened?

Best thing that ever happened. Well, that's a bit of an exaggeration, but I did like it.

3. Fighter Sux: Yes or No?

The only fighter I ever played was a multiclassed fighter/bard, and she is probably my favorite 3e/3.5 PC. The class itself is pretty bland, but I wouldn't say it "sux."

4. Wizard and CoDzilla overpowered to the point of game disruption: yes or no?

Below 10th level, no. In double digit levels, the game began to break, and CoDzilla was the most visible symptom of that breaking.

5. Your 3E games: Rules as written or houseruled into oblivion?

Near-unrecognizable oblivion. The last 3.5 game I ran had a fifty page house rule document, no joke (for the record, my players and I all loved that game).

6. Does your group optimize, or play more casually?

Neither? We build our characters to fit a concept.

7. Eberron: Yes or No?

Very yes. It's the only published setting that I would consider running. I find vanilla fantasy a la Forgotten Realms/Greyhawk/Dragonlance boring beyond belief. I love me some warforged.

8. Do you currently play more 3E, or 4E?(this question is to see where each group falls in terms of the previous questions)

You've probably guessed by now that I play more 4e.

 

[MerricB]

1. Psionics: Good or Bad?
Bad. Dislike the concept, hate the execution. (Alpha Strike? Urgh).

2. Tome of Battle: The antichrist or best thing that ever happened?
I really enjoyed it.

3. Fighter Sux: Yes or No?
No... but needed PHB2 in 3e to make it work.

4. Wizard and CoDzilla overpowered to the point of game disruption: yes or no?
The Druid? Yes, definitely. Wizard, not so much.

5. Your 3E games: Rules as written or houseruled into oblivion?
Rules as written, mostly. High level play needed houseruling as death too common.

6. Does your group optimize, or play more casually?
Both.

7. Eberron: Yes or No?
Yes, but not my world of choice.

8. Do you currently play more 3E, or 4E?
Entirely 4e.

Cheers!

 

[Psion]

Interested in seeing how these really numerically compared, I wasted my night entering all the entries to this point in a spreadsheet...

53/111 "strong negative" on "does fighter suck"
52/111 "strong negative" on "do wizard and CoDzilla disrupt the game"

3) Of 51 4e-only, 15 "no", 10 "maybe/moderate/mixed", 26 "yes"
3) Of 43 3e-only, 27 "no", 10 "maybe/moderate/mixed", 6 "yes"

4) Of 51 4e-only, 26 "no", 11 "maybe/moderate/mixed", 26 "yes"
4) Of 43 3e-only, 27 "no", 10 "maybe/moderate/mixed", 6 "yes"