D&D 5E Where are the whaling vessels? (A.k.a. material for big spenders)

[fjw70]

O

The only problem I have with that theory is this: if there isn't enough money for Hasbro to be interested in the line, why spend two years (and goodness knows how much money) on developing a whole new edition?

Though I suppose it's just about possible Mearls (or someone else) could have persuaded them it's worth it for one last, big payday.

('Big' relative to D&D sales, obviously. )

To leverage the brand. They are still interested in the brand and the RPG is helping keep the brand alive.

 

[Kramodlog]

I find threads like these about as exciting as the 'business of sports' coverage you see on ESPN. I don't really care about how a certain baseball player's contract is structured, I care about how they play the game. Reducing D&D to a commodity and discussing it like one seems to deflate some of the magic of the game to me.

Don't discuss it?

Maybe if more books were released we'd have something to talk about.

 

[Umbran]

I think you folks are missing the scale.

What do you sell to whales? Gaming tables that cost thousands of dollars. Custom gaming rooms. Map projectuon systems. These are whale fodder. But WotC is a publisher. Unless they make a deal with Ikea, it isn't in their wheelhouse.

And, I still think you are all missing why WotC isn't committed to a public plan yet.

MOVIE - the final results of the movie lawsuit have not come down. A big budget movie can be worth hundreds of millions of dollars, and would dwarf any expected earnings from game books.

And, of course, if there were a movie, you'd expect to see game materials to match. A plan with a movie coming up is completely different than one without.

 

[fjw70]

I think that's an issue with Kree-O rather than D&D though.

That could be.

 

[DaveDash]

This model is more for kickstarters.

What WoTC need is the following:
1. A subscriber based service. People are willing to pay x per month even if that means a greater spend over the course of the year.
2. That subscription based service gives you access to all the IP they release online, but there could be varying levels. Gold may also get you free copies of print books.
3. Print on demand service for those that want hard copies.
4. A lot more than just three books. Adventure paths, minis, settings, and a ton of non splat-book products so that people at least feel they're getting value for their yearly subscription, but with a digital first strategy.
5. Keep pushing free 'lite' stuff to grow the brand, OGL, etc, but actually put some quality control around it so the market doesn't get flooded with crap.

I guess this is kind of what Pazio does, but if I was WoTC I'd take it even further. More digital books, higher subscription fees, more digital tools (char gen, dungeon gen, world gen, npc gen, monster gen, etc) that don't require print and can offer value for a subscription, more articles, and basically generate more IP to sell that is digital and thus costs a lot less to produce. Obviously print is still very important (I love my books) but grow through digital, not print.

Now it seems like they did some of this with 4e, but they failed, because they only did it half arsed. They were trying to be a print publisher with some digital products, instead they should be a digital publisher with some print products.

The world is all about software and software as a service these days, cheap monthly price for all you can eat. Not dolphins and whales, that's only for Kickstarters IMO.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

The only problem I have with that theory is this: if there isn't enough money for Hasbro to be interested in the line, why spend two years (and goodness knows how much money) on developing a whole new edition?

Though I suppose it's just about possible Mearls (or someone else) could have persuaded them it's worth it for one last, big payday.

('Big' relative to D&D sales, obviously. )

Because the initial big splash sales of the new edition was expected to be sufficiently profitable that the business plan gained approval (and it keeps the brand alive for other potential projects). The open question is whether Hasbro will approve a non-shrinking headcount and what is the job mix of that headcount.

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

So RPG books aren't what you sell to the RPG whales.

Maybe you sell them video games, or board games, or card games, or novels, or comic books, or whatever, but that's dolphin territory...

I spent a lot of money on 3e and 4e RPG books and I'm still spending quite a lot on Numenera and 13th Age RPG books. RPG books is what you have to sell me if you want my hard-earned whale money. I won't buy board games, cards, adventures or novels.

 

[aramis erak]

The only problem I have with that theory is this: if there isn't enough money for Hasbro to be interested in the line, why spend two years (and goodness knows how much money) on developing a whole new edition?

Though I suppose it's just about possible Mearls (or someone else) could have persuaded them it's worth it for one last, big payday.

('Big' relative to D&D sales, obviously. )

10 people, probably costing under $100K/year each, commercial server at under $2K/year, leftover office space from MTG... to keep in the news a property that can generate a $5M movie deal and links to sales worth a half a million a year (gross)? It's probably within the advertising budget for MTG/WotC... and 2 years of tax writeoff of $1M a year or so?

Plenty of reasons to sink money into it... within reason.

Plus, it may be turned into an "evergreen" product. If all they do is touch up errata and layout every 5 years, they can still keep making money on that investment for at least 15 years by licensing others to write adventures for it.

Further, the RPG is great for building a fan base for novels, and for every die-hard who buys it for the D&D name, figure 1-2 more people find them based upon word of mouth from them... and it snowballs from there.

 

[delericho]

10 people, probably costing under $100K/year each, commercial server at under $2K/year, leftover office space from MTG... to keep in the news a property that can generate a $5M movie deal and links to sales worth a half a million a year (gross)?

Yeah, that makes sense. In which case, the strategy of "produce a new edition, then provide only the most minimal of support" makes sense. Which rather neatly ties in with what we know of the release schedule, so...

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

I think the only Whale product they have at the moment is the miniatures line, though it's a fairly decent one.

The primary focus, at the moment, is in creating minnows. As many as possible. But I agree that they need a plan for getting minnows to become dolphins. Personally, I think some form of product subscription would be best.