Where did -10 come from?

[JoeGKushner]

So you're desinging the D&D game way back when, and you think, "Man, dying at 0 hit points sucks. We need to do something so let's make it a negative number. how about -10..."

?

And then we've got 3rd edition and they decide, "You know, it's some odd 20-30 years latter. Let's keep that -10 thing."

At higher levels, it just doesn't work. Even Monte's variant in AE with the Con being the negative modifier at death.

 

[diaglo]

1edADnD.

when they decided to breakaway from the Chainmail combat rules. and make their own.

 

[Henry]

I'm not sure why you say it doesn't work. Works fine for our games, and has since the mid 1980's (when our groups first used it as a house rule).

To be more specific, it definitely worked well in earlier editions, because the hit point ranges were smaller than today. However, even though the ranges have expanded, it still leaves room for dying, even if the "instant death" range has expanded. It's realistic enough for our group, i guess. Sometimes, you get the debilitating wound that leaves you draining out in seconds, sometimes you just outright get your chest blown out. If anything, the range that could use expanding is the "disabled" range (it's JUST ZERO!) and I like what Arcana Unearthed does for this.

 

[Henrix]

It works even better if you die at -(10+lvl). Then you get a little more leeway at higher levels.

 

[diaglo]

It works even better if you die at -(10+lvl). Then you get a little more leeway at higher levels.

you already have leeway at higher lvls. that's why you get more hps.

i personally prefer 0 = dead

 

[just__al]

In my campaign if hit point damage takes you from positive HP to below -10 you are instead at -9hp and you will die in one round and you don't get a stabilzation roll. This has a lot to do with the fact that I am running a world's largest dungeon campaign and bringing in new characters is a bit of a bear.

My normal rule is -10 modified by your con bonus (so if you have a 14 con you die at -12)

 

[tennyson]

My normal rule is -10 modified by your con bonus (so if you have a 14 con you die at -12)

We use the exact same rule, and it's worked nicely for years.

 

[Vraille Darkfang]

yeah, the -10 never really worked for me.

My problem was the fine, fine, fine, fine, DEAD aspect of high level games.

-10 works GREAT at low levels. Ok, at mid-levels. But sucks at high levels. Most of D&D scales with level (or has a way you can make it scale), but the death range doesn't.

I go with your Con Ability is how far negative you can go, you Character Level, or -10 wichiver is greater (or lesser in this case). THus a 12th level Elf with an 8 Con can go to -11 before being deaded.

 

[Umbran]

I also don't see where you tell us why it doesn't work for you.

For me, it seems fine. I don't like zero = dead for a few basic reasons:
1)It has a touch more... verisimilitude. It's okay that D&D doesn't have a "death spiral", but having only two states (Fully functioning and dead) and such an abrupt transition between them doesn't feel right. With this rule, there's a transition where the character is still alive, but unable to act.

2)It makes for a better story, I think. The character falls, and you've got moments to try to work your way to him for healing before it's really too late...

I don't personally think it needs to be extended for high-level characters. But YMMV.

 

[Rystil Arden]

I also don't see where you tell us why it doesn't work for you.

For me, it seems fine. I don't like zero = dead for a few basic reasons:
1)It has a touch more... verisimilitude. It's okay that D&D doesn't have a "death spiral", but having only two states (Fully functioning and dead) and such an abrupt transition between them doesn't feel right. With this rule, there's a transition where the character is still alive, but unable to act.

2)It makes for a better story, I think. The character falls, and you've got moments to try to work your way to him for healing before it's really too late...

I don't personally think it needs to be extended for high-level characters. But YMMV.

I'm guessing that Joe, like me, has experienced the phenomenon at higher levels where damage totals are so high that nobody is ever at any number of hit points between 0 and -9. When you are tossing around hundreds of damage per character, the 10 hit point buffer becomes insignificant unless you are very lucky.