Which artist is best at which creature type?

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Now you're cookin'.

His Kostchtchie peice is one of my all time favourites.

...and frankly after having seen some of the poor renditions in the BoVD art gallery over on the WotC website I have been hankering for some of the old magic.

I'm trying to track down that picture! And I agree with your assessment of the BOVD art totally. No character to the arch devils or demon princes. The picture of Dispater is horridly generic as in Orcus. The pic in the Tome of Horrors is much better.

 

[The Serge]

I agree that at his best Sam Wood is more than a match for anyone (his stuff in the Monster Manual is simply superb) but lately I just haven't been feeling it from him.

...and I think WARs b&w stuff looks better.

I think you're right about recent Wood material.

As for B&W stuff, I think they use different approaches. WAR tends to go for very crisp, illustrative looks... very much like an uncolored comic book image (that's not a knock. I collect). Wood tends to use a lot of washes, acquiring a more artsy feel. As a result, I think the two styles aren't really comparable.

Are you crazy dude!?

The verdicts still out on that one!

What about the 1st Ed. Manual of the Planes cover?

Hmmm... That one's not bad. But, I think the poor fool fleeing the Astral Dreadnought looks retarded and I think the image itself is very static. It has no energy aside from the retard. The Dreadnought is just in the middle of the picture reaching out.... but I'm not afraid of it. Very dull. And, then there's that clunky look again. Nope! I don't like it!

(in fact pretty much all the 1st Ed. Hardback covers, we are talking seminal work here dude!)

I hate every single one of those covers.

His cover forLegends and Lore, with Odin on the cover...? Ugh! Odin's face looks like something from a Warner Brother's cartoon. Why is the horse sneering (yeah, I know it's not a real horse, but the wrinkles around the eyes look lame... not to mention the frown). Are those wolves or weasels; the muzzles look like they were chipped from wood... The horse looks more threatening than the wolves!

And, since TSR couldn't find anyone else, they asked him to return for the 2ed verison, which, if possible, is even worse and less awe-inspiring than the 1ed version.

The "wizard" on the 1ed DMG looks like he's wearing a heavy, plastic robe. His "enigmatic" smile looks like he's just found a pretty little girl to torment (perhaps that's the point).

The Red Dragon surrounded by pegasi... Why does the dragon's snarling wrinkles look like huge plastic folds?

I'll stop there.

I dunno I guess I was never big on Dragonlance and so what really sticks in my mind are the lacklustre peices in the Monster Manual (Titan for instance).

And the boring as all nymph.

Elmore has declined dramatically as an artist. The Titan is a great example of that. And, I think when it comes to very intense, action-oriented scenes, there have always been better artists. But, compared to Easely, he's a god.

His Kostchtchie peice is one of my all time favourites.

WHERE!!!!!! Is there a link to the image somewhere?

He also did an image of Orcus (for FR, I believe; it's a idol of Orcus surrounded by cultists) and this fantastic as hell picture of a masked wizard and his pet Hellhound! The molten lava replacing dog saliva! GREAT!!!!

...and frankly after having seen some of the poor renditions in the BoVD art gallery over on the WotC website I have been hankering for some of the old magic.

By and large, the art in the BoVD is pathetic all around. Heck, the best images were the ones on the chapter pages!

Demogorgon looks really, really dumb. He looks like a rubber and wire child's toy (I don't care about the heads... although they could confuse one with Yeenoghu). I thought Graz'zt was supposed to be drop-dead gorgeous? Instead, we get a guy with really wierd looking legs (interestingly, the artist who did Graz'zt turned out some great work in Races of Faerun).

Not one of the Lords of the Nine matched his/her description... although Bel came the closest. Belial and Fierana are hideous (particularly Belial) rather than diabolically seducative. Dispater (another Easley travesty) doesn't look all that conservative, doesn't appear to be made from iron, and doesn't appear to be wise. He looks like he's ready to lay the smack-down. Although I love WAR, his Mephisto is not what I hoped. His Mephisto looks like a goth reject rather than an immensely powerful, stylish Arch-Duke of Hell in elaborate, flowing cloaks and robes (what's with the greasy hair?).

And Asmodeus. Let's not get into that.

Yep. The art in BoVD sucks.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hello Krusty!

Hey Zander mate!

I have to say that with regards to Jeff Easley's art, I agree with The Serge:

Bah!

My favourite fantasy artists are (in no particular order):

• Larry Elmore
• Keith Parkinson
• Clyde Caldwell
• Chris Achileos
• Dennis Beauvais
• Frank Frazetta
• Gustave Doré

When you come to my place for dinner on one of the evenings before UK GenCon, I'll show you some artbooks with their work in them.

Look forward to it!

BTW Chris Achileos will be at UK GenCon.

I am still chaffing that I never got to talk to Wayne Reynolds last year, even though he was but 3 feet away from me.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Flexor mate!

I'm trying to track down that picture!

Cover of Dragon magazine #119

...if you have Dragon #300 look at the pages with all the covers and you will see it (albeit small)...

...in fact just found a link amd it turns out it wasn't Keith Parkinson after all Shows what I know.

http://bioinfo.mshri.on.ca/people/feldman/vgmuseum/dd/dragon119.jpg

And I agree with your assessment of the BOVD art totally. No character to the arch devils or demon princes. The picture of Dispater is horridly generic as in Orcus.

I hate to use such strong language but I thought some of the depictions of the Arch Fiends in that book bordered on a disgrace...and for those in question - yes I could do better!

The pic in the Tome of Horrors is much better.

Absolutely.

When even 20 year old black and white illustrations make the BoVD look bad you know its bad.

That said, Mephisto (even though I still say he should be blue); Mammon and Yeenoghu looked good.

 

[Oni]

They're not dnd related artist, but I've always been partial to the Hildebrandt brother's depiction of Smaug. While his ability to take flight might be questionable, the picture that exudes a mighty, majestic quality in my opinion.


Also I'd love to see more dnd stuff from Parkinson, he's hands down my favorite.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi Serge mate!

I think you're right about recent Wood material.

You know it makes sense!

As for B&W stuff, I think they use different approaches. WAR tends to go for very crisp, illustrative looks... very much like an uncolored comic book image (that's not a knock. I collect). Wood tends to use a lot of washes, acquiring a more artsy feel. As a result, I think the two styles aren't really comparable.

To me Woods b&w looks like colour illustrations printed in b&w.

The verdicts still out on that one!

I'm afraid thats

Hmmm... That one's not bad. But, I think the poor fool fleeing the Astral Dreadnought looks retarded and I think the image itself is very static. It has no energy aside from the retard. The Dreadnought is just in the middle of the picture reaching out.... but I'm not afraid of it. Very dull. And, then there's that clunky look again. Nope! I don't like it!

C'mon the Manual of the Planes cover is inspirational!

I hate every single one of those covers.

I knew you were crazy!

His cover forLegends and Lore, with Odin on the cover...? Ugh! Odin's face looks like something from a Warner Brother's cartoon.

Its the Marvel Odin, I loved it!

Why is the horse sneering (yeah, I know it's not a real horse, but the wrinkles around the eyes look lame... not to mention the frown). Are those wolves or weasels; the muzzles look like they were chipped from wood... The horse looks more threatening than the wolves!

Thats cos they are good aligned wolves.

And, since TSR couldn't find anyone else, they asked him to return for the 2ed verison, which, if possible, is even worse and less awe-inspiring than the 1ed version.

Admittedly 1st Ed. was his best period.

The "wizard" on the 1ed DMG looks like he's wearing a heavy, plastic robe.

Ringlerun, I have that plastic toy version of him, funny you mention it.

His "enigmatic" smile looks like he's just found a pretty little girl to torment (perhaps that's the point).

Enigmatic - you mean like the Mona Lisa - I told you he was genius.

The Red Dragon surrounded by pegasi... Why does the dragon's snarling wrinkles look like huge plastic folds?

I'll stop there.

Bah! Nitpicks every one.

Elmore has declined dramatically as an artist. The Titan is a great example of that. And, I think when it comes to very intense, action-oriented scenes, there have always been better artists. But, compared to Easely, he's a god.

Yeah, they were very bland though I thought that was because they were 'lifted' from past products

WHERE!!!!!! Is there a link to the image somewhere?

See the link I provided in my previous post.

He also did an image of Orcus (for FR, I believe; it's a idol of Orcus surrounded by cultists)

Cover of 'H4 Mines of Bloodstone' adventure.

and this fantastic as hell picture of a masked wizard and his pet Hellhound! The molten lava replacing dog saliva! GREAT!!!!

I think I know the one you mean.

By and large, the art in the BoVD is pathetic all around. Heck, the best images were the ones on the chapter pages!

I am already disappointed and I haven't even got the book yet!

Demogorgon looks really, really dumb. He looks like a rubber and wire child's toy (I don't care about the heads... although they could confuse one with Yeenoghu).

Yep, he looks like two strings of speghetti.

I thought Graz'zt was supposed to be drop-dead gorgeous? Instead, we get a guy with really wierd looking legs (interestingly, the artist who did Graz'zt turned out some great work in Races of Faerun).

Yes Graz'zt wen't from looking like Elvis circe 1972 to...

Not one of the Lords of the Nine matched his/her description... although Bel came the closest.

Yep, forgot that I liked Bel.

Belial and Fierana are hideous (particularly Belial) rather than diabolically seducative.

Agreed.

Dispater (another Easley travesty) doesn't look all that conservative, doesn't appear to be made from iron, and doesn't appear to be wise. He looks like he's ready to lay the smack-down.

Dispater was disappointing, but they have been messing about with his appearance ever since his first incarnation.

Although I love WAR, his Mephisto is not what I hoped. His Mephisto looks like a goth reject rather than an immensely powerful, stylish Arch-Duke of Hell in elaborate, flowing cloaks and robes (what's with the greasy hair?).

Its a good peice, just not how I see Mephisto either.

And Asmodeus. Let's not get into that.

Indeed.

Yep. The art in BoVD sucks.

Overall disappointing.

Why couldn't they just expand on what had gone before rather than 'try' and reinvent them.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Hey Flexor mate!



Cover of Dragon magazine #119

...if you have Dragon #300 look at the pages with all the covers and you will see it (albeit small)...

...in fact just found a link amd it turns out it wasn't Keith Parkinson after all Shows what I know.

http://bioinfo.mshri.on.ca/people/feldman/vgmuseum/dd/dragon119.jpg



I hate to use such strong language but I thought some of the depictions of the Arch Fiends in that book bordered on a disgrace...and for those in question - yes I could do better!



Absolutely.

When even 20 year old black and white illustrations make the BoVD look bad you know its bad.

That said, Mephisto (even though I still say he should be blue); Mammon and Yeenoghu looked good.

I wasn't sure it was Parkinson myself but I was sure that was a dynamite cover painting, and a great cover design. Clean & elegant with an awesome painting. Compare that to the GamePro style covers of today.

 

[Pants]

Hmm I must be the only one who liked the BoVD art.

-Demogorgon, hyena heads aside, looked truly alien, sinuous, and evil.
-Juiblex, well to be honest, I haven't liked any of the pictures of Juiblex. Though the 1st edition one was the best with this coming in 2nd place.
-Grazzt, he could be better, especially his largely disproportionate left arm
-Yeenoghu was great

-Asmodeus, get rid of the ridiculous hair and he's perfect
-Baalzebul, the problem with him is not the art (which looks fine), but the concept behind it, namely a big-fricken slug. There are only so many ways to make a slug look cool
-Bel, looked fine
-Levistus, looked fine
-Mephistopheles, looked fine to me
-Dispater, would you rather have an amateurishly drawn pic like in the 1st edition MM? Personally, I don't have a problem with him
-Hag Countess, looks pretty creepy and disgusting looking to me, fits the bill
-Belial and Fierna, probably my least favorite of the pictures, Belial looks really crappy

 

[Kai Lord]

Hmm I must be the only one who liked the BoVD art.

-Demogorgon, hyena heads aside, looked truly alien, sinuous, and evil.

I also liked Demogorgon. Very reminiscent of John Carpenter's "The Thing".

 

[demiurge1138]

I'll chip in my two cents on the BOVD art...
Well, I'll agree that the arch-devils should have been better. But Bel had a pretty cool pic and WAR's Mephistopheles fits for the new "I am the god of Hellfire" Mephisto.
The demons, on the other hand, I liked. I agree that Orcus was just a big generic demon, but he was a well-done generic demon. Points for competance, if not for personality. The Demogorgon is kind of off, but the Big D is really weird looking and alien, anyway. The Gumby demon look is fitting. Grazz't bugged me, though. Yeenoghu and Jubilex are very well done, IMHO.
But what nobody's mentioned is the non-arch fiend art in BOVD. I, for one, am quite fond of WAR's two demonic lineups (Mane, Rutterkin and Bar-lugha and Chasme, Shadow Demon and Babau).

Demiurge out.