Which PrCl would you never want in your game? (part 1 - DMG)

[dnabre]

Really should be a none option....

While they're are certainly some that I wouldn't want to play. I wouldn't have a problem with any of them in my game. Some might have require a minor flavor tweak, like Red Wizard would tagged as a member of a specific organization in my world. And if a player was going to pick up Arcane Archer, I'd certainly make sure they understood the stacking rules for magic arrows and magic bows.

Beyond that, they're all acceptable. Some are bland, some I don't like the flavor of, but none do I have an issue with to the point of not wanting in my game.

 

[Klaus]

No Dragon Disciples (as no half-dragons) and no Horizon Walkers (absolutely no plane-hopping in my campaigns, ever).

Pretty simple.

You do realize the Horizon Walker has 5 levels of non-plane-hopping, right? Just levels 6-10 (or stick with the non-planar terrain masteries).

Personally, I'd rewrite the Arcane Archer and the Arcane Trickster.

 

[Ace]

I am astounded that the Horizon Walker is so high on this list. Many find it a fairly weak PrC, but I've always thought it very flavorful.

As am I -- it is also really easy to fix if you don't have planar travel in your game -- just make it a 5 level class and disallow the Planar terrains -- easy peasy

of course someone just said this before me -- mea culpa and DOH!

However as far as autoban -- in general I don't like any of the Evil classes for PC's -- The rest are "meh" except the Horizon Walker which I like

 

[ThirdWizard]

I have left the "None" option out of the poll on purpose: the aim of this poll is to see which PrCl from the DMG gets more "thumbs down", then I'll put up another poll for another book and then again, and at the end there will be a final match to elect the "loser of the losers"

I demand the right to post on all polls whether or not my oppinion matters.

 

[Greylock]

Lots of folks don't do forays into the planes frequently enough to justify a class.

There's no reason why a HW would have to be a plane tripper. The DMG allows the HW to continue and take non-planar terrains after 5th level. I think it's a neat and very flavorful PrC, and one that I am itching for the right game for. No Feats, no combat tricks, no spells, no supernatural abilities. Just a classic explorer/adventurer. It's almost a Dan'l Boone, Marco Polo, Cap'n Cook type char concept.

It just bothers me to see it dismissed out of hand, and lumped in with Uber-PrCs.

 

[Bront]

Assassin, Blackguard, and Red Wizard. No Evil games for me, thanks.

Ditto

 

[Saeviomagy]

Worse than any balance issues in my opinion is that these classes allow one player to fill in two slots, which might be okay in a small party, but what happens to the player of the wizard who is overshadowed by the MT player who is dishing out healing and holy words on top of arcane magic? Takes some potential fun from the game IMHO.

Oh, I don't know. Probably the fact that the wizard has an entire spell level more spells, isn't wasting actions on divine spells, and is more focussed towards arcane stuff, and therefore (probably) better would do it.

Even when you have both progressions of magic, you're not using divine magic AS WELL AS arcane magic - you only get so many actions per turn, so you're using divine magic instead of arcane magic.

And frankly, arcane magic is far better - otherwise why would clerics get all that stuff (armour, weapons, hitpoints, saves, turning etc) to make up for it?

 

[Pants]

I don't really care for the Dragon Disciple (personal reason), Thaumaturge (rules reason), and the Duelist (it sucks).

I pick the Duelist. It just.... sucks.

 

[Storm Raven]

Worse than any balance issues in my opinion is that these classes allow one player to fill in two slots, which might be okay in a small party, but what happens to the player of the wizard who is overshadowed by the MT player who is dishing out healing and holy words on top of arcane magic? Takes some potential fun from the game IMHO.

Let's look at it then.

For the first three levels, the two characters are exactly the same. The Mystic Theurge-to-be (MTTB for short) takes three levels of wizard, and the straight wizard takes three levels of wizard.

For the next three levels, the MTTB takes three levels of cleric, gaining access to 2nd level clerical spells, while the straight wizard takes three levels of wizard, gaining access to third level wizard spells, and is just about ready to get fourth level spells.

The MTTB can now start taking Mystic Thuerge levels. He takes two levels of the PrC, and now, at 8th level, can cast third level spells in his two classes. Exciting! He can cast fireball and cure serious wounds (by the way, at 5th level caster ability each, so its only a 5 die fireball). Meanwhile, his wizard buddy has been casting the fireball spell for three levels now, and casts an 8 die version. Plus he has been casting 4th level spells since his last level too, so while his MMTB friend can cast cure serious wounds, he can cast stoneskin, dimension door, ice storm, and greater invisibility. Finally, the straight wizard is one short level away from 5th level spell, while the MTTB is going to have to wait until 10th level to get 4th level spells.

Do I need to tell you how this works out at 9th level when the straight wizard can cast 5th level spells, while his MTTB companion is still slinging 3rd level spells as his best option?

I don't think the straight wizard will feel anything but sorry for the pitiable MTTB.

 

[Romnipotent]

Red Wizard, because that would mean Im running FR... and that is not something I want to do, ever.

Vermin lord for 3e, and Chameleon for 3.5 non DMG.