Which PrCl would you never want in your game? (part 1 - DMG)

[Greylock]

Horizon Walker, mainly because I don't feature much plane-hopping in my games.

*bangs head against wall*

 

[cmanos]

Red Wizard

1) its FR and I HATE all things FR.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Well, if I could think of a way to alter the arcane classes so that they wouldn't need a PrC in order to justify certain multiclassing combos in a non-abusable manner, I'd do it. But so far I've not seen a simple solution to the problem. Making spellcasting a group of skills might do it, but it would require a big alteration of the existing game and likely a magic system so different from what we are used to seeing that it wouldn't feel like D&D to many.

The simplest way I've seen is the feat that gives you +4 caster level.

Well, admittedly this is a house rule that changes the game in big ways, but I give every creature a "Base Magical Bonus" that functions and advances like a "Base Attack Bonus." This BMB is used to calculate caster level and possible access to spells. Big spellcasting classes get +1/level, bards are closer to +2/3, classes like rangers and paladins are nearer +1/2, and nonmagic classes like fighters and rogues are basically +1/3.

Then there are feats that give some minor spellcasting, kind of like what gnomes get, but with the ability to build on that to higher levels. And there's magic items that make use of it. PrC's that make use of it. Feats that allow supernatural abilities that make use of it.

It just strikes me as entirely goofy that a wizard can be better at hitting things than a newbie fighter, but even the most experienced fighter won't be better at casting magic than a newbie wizard, despite all the wizards, all the magical items, all the magical creatures, all the supernatural effects, all the wonderous events, that occur to him on a daily basis.

The thing is, if I can't think of a better way to do it, and some player decides to play a Wizard/fighter (as opposed to a Fighter/wizard, which I can do), then I'd have to allow a PrC before the concept would be truly viable - and I really don't like PrC's.

Yeah, I don't like the fact that you're forced to do that. I'm a fan of PrC's, but I don't like the fact that a Wizard/Cleric *has* to choose one particular PrC or be useless. There's infinite variation on what a Wizard/Cleric can be. God of magic? Magic as a god itself? Knowledge is divine power? Science giving you the might of gods? But all are subsumed into Mystic Theurges becuase the MT gives you full spellcasting. They should just be able to be a Wiz/Clr without choosing a PrC....not as powerful as a pure Wiz or pure Clr, but still viable.

So you want magic to be like in Diablo--even Fighters get some magical ability, but they're so crappy at it there's not much point in using it unless they can't do anything else?

More, I want to give everyone another resource to spend, and more ways to spend that resource. Who says fighters shouldn't be able to use that to improve their own fighting ability? Or to make them more diverse in their talents; able to Charm Person or generate a devensive aura, or whatever.

 

[Psion]

There's no reason why a HW would have to be a plane tripper. The DMG allows the HW to continue and take non-planar terrains after 5th level. I think it's a neat and very flavorful PrC, and one that I am itching for the right game for. No Feats, no combat tricks, no spells, no supernatural abilities. Just a classic explorer/adventurer. It's almost a Dan'l Boone, Marco Polo, Cap'n Cook type char concept.

I had thought about mentioning that upthread myself. But that's not the prestige class as-is. It's a tweak.

Heck, I'd like the MT more if you front-loaded it a bit and took a few of their spellcasting levels away and replace them with fixed abilities. (More than like... I made such a class.) But that's not the MT as is.

 

[Pseudonym]

I chose Assassin, mainly because I still view it as an occupaton rather than a class. The same with ninja, but that's for another thread.

I also don't allow Blackguards or Red Wizards since I don't run evil games. The one blackguardish NPC I created worked better as a straight evil cleric.

 

[Sejs]

*bangs head against wall*

Yes, I am aware it's not required to take the planar abilities for levels 6-10. However, some degree of planes hopping is conceptually tied to the class itself, hence Planar Terrain Mastery.

As for the standpoint of "well, you don't have to take planar terrains" - there are 8 non-planar terrain types. It's a 10 level class. I'm curious; what do you propose a fully non-planar 10th level Horizon Walker take for their last two abilities?

 

[CRGreathouse]

I think diaglo needs to use this as an avatar.

 

[CRGreathouse]

Yes, I am aware it's not required to take the planar abilities for levels 6-10. However, some degree of planes hopping is conceptually tied to the class itself, hence Planar Terrain Mastery.

Planar Terrain Mastery doesn't show that the planes are tied to the class at all -- it shows that you *can't* take *any* planar abilities for the first 5 levels. It's to make sure you are grounded in non-planar skills (although you can develop those later on, if desired).

As for the remaining levels -- assuming the character gets past level 8, or in deed level 5 -- I'd recommend making more terrain abilities. Of course some would suggest multiclassing (perhaps back into ranger), but I imagine someone with 8 levels in HW is fairly devoted to the concept.

 

[Sunderstone]

They all are fine to me, though some will be used more as NPC adversaries. Out of the list Id have to go with the Red Wizard being that Ive left FR behind in favor of returning to GH.

 

[Greylock]

I had thought about mentioning that upthread myself. But that's not the prestige class as-is. It's a tweak.

Why is it not the PrC "as-is"? My copy of the DMG says you can take any terrain you want after 5th. And nothing in the PrC says you have to have Plane walked. Some of the planar terrains just give elemental resistances.

As for "No Planar travel in MY campaign", well, it slips in with ease. One of the DMs I play with has told me several times that he "doesn't do" planar stuff. Yet, my char joined the game in a short planar episode. And do these folks who "don't do" planes never have Outsiders, or Celestials, or Abyssal creatures etc etc in the game?