Who was right

[Moff_Tarkin]

One thing, this is a new campaign. These characters were created at level 12 not 1.

OK, I’ll try to post my final say on the word. I can guarantee that I won’t respond to further arguments but I will try to make this my closing statement.

When the Fighter gave up all the money he got from this battle to the monk and me to replace our lost items, he quoted that he had no need for gold. Some people at the table were confused at this but I quickly caught on. Once you have your fundamental items (weapon, armor, etc.) you're good. And everything else is just gravy. He confirmed my assertion was correct. In fact I hade a whole list of magical items I planed on selling off to get my shield back because they were just “extra” items and didn’t have a major effect on the life of my character.

That shield was a major, in fact the biggest, part of my character. The loss of it crippled me, the party tank. That’s why it should have been replaced by the party. Its not a nifty little item like a hat of disguise or a ring of evasion that you use to make your life a little easier. It was a cornerstone item that was critical to the functioning of my character. Being the party tank then suddenly losing 9 AC is pretty crippling in my book.

People keep making the stupid argument of whether I should pay for the wizards spell component or the archers arrows. Ok buddy, I’ll pay for your 2 silver piece arrow and you can chip in on my 25,000 gold piece shield. Sounds good to me. I would come out ahead.

 

[mmadsen]

That shield was a major, in fact the biggest, part of my character. The loss of it crippled me, the party tank. That’s why it should have been replaced by the party.

Now you're finally making some sense. If it's in the party's best interest to help you buy a new shield, that's far more convincing than whining that you've been wronged. Of course, the party should probably look at what they can best do with that gold, whether or not it involves you and a new shield.

 

[Moff_Tarkin]

One more thing to add on to my closing arguments.

About all the other foolish arguments about how I was reckless or put my shield in harms way. Can I ask what you geniuses do with your shields? Other then go into battle with them of course. Its not like I was ridding it down the stairs like a sled. I did the only thing your supposed to do with a shield. Please inform me where the reckless part came in.

 

[Crothian]

That shield was a major, in fact the biggest, part of my character.

I think this here is one of the biggest problems. An item should not be the biggest part of the character. The character should be way more important then any amount of items, let alone a single one.

 

[Tequila Sunrise]

From what you've told us of the situation, I think I'd have to side with you Tarkin. Not because of any particular argument, because the situation can be argued backwards and forwards, but just because D&D is a team game. It's not like monopoly where you're supposed to be happy when another player lands on luxury tax. I would think that it would be in the whole party's interest to replace a large chunk of what makes your character such a great meat shield. Then again maybe your character should start acting like an individual rather than a team player like the other half of the party is doing. The next time you encounter a big scary monster, give it a clear shot at the party casters while you perform a "careful flanking maneuver" while gripping your sword with two hands and tell them that "I just don't have the protection to take hits for you anymore". It might be bending your CoC but it might help if the other players see how the loss of your shield is their loss.

If nothing else, losing a 25,000 gp shield makes a PC feel real and the fact that certain other players seem to lack any empathy for you is a sad reflection of their rp motivation and attitude.

TS

PS: I feel the opposite way about the monk's dispelled enchantment. Having a buff via the permanency spell is a cheap way to get a buff and its just asking enemy casters to dispel your cash down the drain.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Some observations:
Moff comes across as a weasel and a jerk.

Being rude about other people makes you come across as a jerk.

It isn't allowed, don't do it.

Thanks

 

[FalcWP]

About all the other foolish arguments about how I was reckless or put my shield in harms way. Can I ask what you geniuses do with your shields? Other then go into battle with them of course. Its not like I was ridding it down the stairs like a sled. I did the only thing your supposed to do with a shield. Please inform me where the reckless part came in.

You invested money in something that is used in a manner that may lead to its own destruction through regular use. Yes, you were using it for the good of the group, but that doesn't mean they owe you for it.

When you buy a car, what do you do? You get it insured. Why? Because using a car means you risk destroying it.

As the owner of an item, you can be reasonably expected to provide for proper maintenance or replacement of an item.

Lets say you carpool with people. They might pay you for gas. But if your car breaks down, do you immediately turn to each of them and say, 'When we get our paychecks, you each need to take out X dollars and pay for me fixing my car'?

 

[Will]

Completely right, Plane Sailing. My apologies.

 

[Imp]

Honestly, it sounds like Moff_Tarkin is playing at a fairly antagonistic table. DM decides to crush his character's strong point, he tries to get money out of his comrades, etc. etc. I mean, I'd laugh at his argument too if I had his shield broken IMC and he wanted to go to the courts ("what courts?" I respond) but there's a ton of other things leading up to this that I wouldn't have done either so I'm not 100% unsympathetic to his greivances here.

Certainly his best argument is: "I'm the tank. You guys need me to be a good tank. If I don't hold your enemies back, you may all die the next time around. Now, how about ponying up for a decent new shield?"

(But then, IMC, a lot of the cost of a magic item comes from its materials; having a broken +5 tower shield is much much better than not having a +5 tower shield at all.)

 

[billd91]

One more thing to add on to my closing arguments.

About all the other foolish arguments about how I was reckless or put my shield in harms way. Can I ask what you geniuses do with your shields? Other then go into battle with them of course. Its not like I was ridding it down the stairs like a sled. I did the only thing your supposed to do with a shield. Please inform me where the reckless part came in.

The arguments aren't foolish. Any time you go into a risky situation, you risk your character's health and equipment. That's a given. So what do you do? You accept the risk and accept the consequences. If you want the other PCs to help you cover the loss, ask them to help you cover the loss. Argue about it being in their own interests if you want and if you think that will work. Don't try to weasel out a "claim" that anyone owes you anything. They don't owe you any deviation from the standard treasure-dividing agreement that you've been working with so far.