D&D 5E Why are Mercane, Kandori, & Reigar's celestials?

[bloodtide]

It's the same old edition problem. Each edition tries to "fit" each race or creature into the "new rules". But, a lot of it is just someone somewhere just says "they are X", for this edition.

All three were just normal mortal beings in Ye Old 2E Spelljammer....though each did have a "special" bit about them so they were not 100% normal beings.

3E started it by making the Mercane suddenly outsiders. Reigar too. Though 3E also kept the humanoid Mercane too. And space whales were just creatures.

By the time you get to 5E, most creatures have jumped all around as to "what" they are "now". Technically even in 5E Mercane should be "outsiders" or "planuals" or such as a neutral non mortal plane hopping race. But 5E does not go into such detail for planual races. Maybe the Planescape Product will fix it?

Space Whales are "celestials" as they need to be non-mortal plane travelers....as 5E Spelljamming is Planejamming. So Kindori fly up into 'space' of the 'Astal Sea' and 'swim' around the Multiverse in 5E.

If they change around all the types of creatures again for "not 6E" they will likely change everything again.

 

[Kobold Avenger]

I'm quite sure if the Rilmani return in 5e, they'd have the creature type of "Celestial" despite not being from the Neutal Plane the Outlands instead of any Upper Plane. Though there's some precedence in that as mortal planetouched descendants of Rilmani were just considered Aasimar.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Because they aint constructs or fiends.

 

[Parmandur]

I stand corrected. I only found the previous errata, I guess. My apologies.

No worries, the second major errata is pretty easy to miss on a quick Google, and it made big changes.

 

[Orius]

Celestial doesn't really fit the mercane very well. They were always traders and only became active across the multiverse when Planescape yoinked them from Spelljammer and made them traders in magic in general rather than spelljamming stuff (though the 2e MM already had them as a standard monster at that point.). Yes, 3e made them outsiders (and changed their name from arcane probably to avoid confusion with magic stuff), but of 5e's types giant makes the most sense. Another case of WotC not knowing what they're doing IMO.

And the Reigar. Weren't they the really chaotic artiste types that would do anything for the sake of artistic expression, including blowing up their own homeworld? How in the flipping hell do they count as celestials?!

 

[Umbran]

And the Reigar. Weren't they the really chaotic artiste types that would do anything for the sake of artistic expression, including blowing up their own homeworld? How in the flipping hell do they count as celestials?!

Honorary members by dedication to an ideal?

 

[Orius]

Fiends are dedicated to their ideals too, but it sure as hell doesn't make them celestials.

Granted I'm not an expert on Spelljammer but weren't the Reigar really narcissistic and egotistical about everything? I would not count them among the likes of angels, archons, guardinals, and even hollyphants.

 

[Teemu]

I'm quite sure if the Rilmani return in 5e, they'd have the creature type of "Celestial" despite not being from the Neutal Plane the Outlands instead of any Upper Plane. Though there's some precedence in that as mortal planetouched descendants of Rilmani were just considered Aasimar.

They would probably be monstrosities. 5e monstrosities include creatures like doppelgangers, ettercaps, gnolls (since Monsters of the Multiverse), harpies, and medusas. Rilmani would fit right in.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

Actually, the latest Errata from November did change the Creature Type for Mercane from Giant to Celestial, and provided new fluff on them being the creation of gods of Commerce, and some new fluff for Reigar coming from Ysgard

Leveling Up Our Creative Process: Learnings From Spelljammer

In this blog post, I'll talk about how we in the D&D Studio are changing our review process following the problematic content that appeared in Spell...

www.dndbeyond.com

Hope that clears it up, @Henadic Theologian

"Mercane (p. 37). The mercane’s creature type has been changed to “Celestial.” The first paragraph of the mercane description has been replaced with the following: Mercanes are the mysterious, magical creations of one or more deities whose portfolios revolve around fair commerce. Standing 12 feet tall, they are lanky blue beings who dress in elegant robes and have elongated heads and long, spindly fingers. Mercanes conduct most of their business in Wildspace and the Astral Sea. To a mercane, commerce can take many forms, from the trading of goods and services to the trading of ideas and information. Mercanes are best known, however, for procuring and selling magic items, including artifacts and spelljamming helms. It’s rare to see more than one mercane at a time, though it’s common for a mercane to be accompanied by underlings or bodyguards."

"Reigar (p. 47). In the description of the talarith and in the reigar’s Summon Golem trait (changed to Summon Duplicate), all instances of the word “golem” have been changed to “duplicate.” The first two paragraphs of the reigar description have been updated as follows: Reigar were once cephalopods similar to octopi. They inhabited the stormy seas of Ysgard until the gods of that plane transformed them. Reigar have bioluminescent freckles and the ability to change the coloration of their skin. A glory (or halo) surrounds each of them. This magical display is a cloud of twinkling, glittering motes that changes color randomly and repels attacks. Gifted with audacious hearts, reigar emerged from the Ysgardian seas to test their mettle on land. When the endless battles there grew tiresome, some reigar ventured to the Astral Sea and Wildspace in search of glory. Many are driven by artistic pursuits, but each reigar has their own notion of what constitutes art. For some, warfare is the highest form of artistic endeavor. Other reigar create art of a more benign nature."

These are huge changes, like damn, the set I bought is worth even less now.

Its even the only big change, the Space Penguins are a Feywild race now.

Another creature lost its Priests.


Anyone else think some of these changes are related to Planescape?

Like why else change Mercane's to Celestial servants of the Gods of none evl Capitalism?

And what happened to the Reigar's home world, got replaced by an outer celestial plane?


Anyone else want to know why such major changes were made?

 

[Shardstone]

Because they aint constructs or fiends.

It really is this simple. The definition of celestial has expanded. I like that. I think it should include a lot of things native to the Astral Plane, imo.