Why aren't RPGs poplular

[lewpuls]

Interesting discussion.

Tabletop RPGs aren't popular compared to computer RPGs because:
1) people don't need to read the computer RPG rules
2) you can play a computer RPG solo, can't do that with tabletop
3) while tabletop is generally more fun with a good referee, most referees aren't so good

It's not a matter of marketing. Hasbro's biggest problem is, as Mike Gray (senior product acquisition guy) says in a solemn voice, "people have to read the rules". And most people won't, or won't get it if they do. With a TRPG the players might not have to read many rules, but the referees have to read tons of rules.

Lew Pulsipher

 

[delericho]

3) while tabletop is generally more fun with a good referee, most referees aren't so good

Nitpick: I would argue you need a good group (including a good referee). A single bad player can really ruin an RPG session, and not every group have the will (or sometimes even the desire) to kick out that one disruptive influence.

 

[Jhaelen]

Actually, Dungeons & Dragons wasn't the first roleplaying game, just the first commercially available one. The first was Braunstein. A military style game where players took the roles of individual agents, trying to achieve different goals in a town.

Arenson was the first player, under the game's creator and first GM, Major David Wesely.



Arenson was the first player as we think of the term. he and Gygax took off with D&D. When they showed it to Wesely he had no interest in the game, as he had no interest in fantasy.

Thanks for the additional info - that's really an interesting article!

 

[lewpuls]

Nitpick: I would argue you need a good group (including a good referee). A single bad player can really ruin an RPG session, and not every group have the will (or sometimes even the desire) to kick out that one disruptive influence.

Fair enough. The really good refs will usually find/make a good group. But the marginally good ones might not be able to arrange it all on their own.

 

[Mark Chance]

Interesting thread. Still, I'm not quite sure what to make of it. I mean, almost all of my friends play RPGs. How much more popular do they need to be?

P.S. Hello, Lew!

 

[lewpuls]

Hi Mark,

The problem is that tabletop RPG sales SUCK. And have for several years, perhaps excepting sales of the very largest companies.

Most young people, even those who play video games a lot, have not played tabletop RPGs.

The point of my original response was, I guess, that there isn't much to be done about it.

 

[BOZ]

I guess we soldier on, then!

 

[Mark Chance]

Most young people, even those who play video games a lot, have not played tabletop RPGs.

But is that anything new? Because I suffer from delusions of adequacy, I've always pictured me as being something of a rarity. I fell into gaming pretty much on accident and largely on my own. No one introduced me to RPGs. In the 6th grade, operating under the Finders Keepers Rule, I found the Basic D&D blue book and a hand-drawn, graph-paper map in a desk as school. A friend and I got together after school and tried to figure out what it all meant.

RPGs aren't a casual game. If I'm on the way to a dinner party and need to bring a game with me, it's not going to be an RPG. It's much more likely that we'll end up playing canasta or spades. If I'm eating with a brainier bunch, we might break out the Scrabble board.

That said, there are new gamers out there. My son Christopher has been granted Probationary Junior Man Status and now gets to play on Man Day. We also have a new adult member who's played less 3.5 than Christopher.

As far as sales being bad, I imagine that's largely due to two factors (at least in the U.S.): the double-digit unemployment rate coupled with a lot of what's being produced not being worth the cover price.

IOW, it's about priorities. I'm underemployed right now. I've been unemployed three times in the past two or so years. I'm trying to start up my own small-time PDF publisher (see link in sig). My bathroom needs remodeling. I've got to wash the algae off the stucco outside the house.

Shelling out money for luxury items like new RPG products is low on my list of things to do.

So, like BOZ said, I soldier on, and get by with what I have.

 

[Guest 85555]

But is that anything new? Because I suffer from delusions of adequacy, I've always pictured me as being something of a rarity. I fell into gaming pretty much on accident and largely on my own. No one introduced me to RPGs. In the 6th grade, operating under the Finders Keepers Rule, I found the Basic D&D blue book and a hand-drawn, graph-paper map in a desk as school. A friend and I got together after school and tried to figure out what it all meant.

RPGs aren't a casual game. If I'm on the way to a dinner party and need to bring a game with me, it's not going to be an RPG. It's much likely that we'll end up playing canasta or spades. If I'm eating with a brainier bunch, we might break out the Scrabble board.

That said, there are new gamers out there. My son Christopher has been granted Probationary Junior Man Status and now gets to play on Man Day. We also have a new adult member who's played less 3.5 than Christopher.

As far as sales being bad, I imagine that's largely due to two factors (at least in the U.S.): the double-digit unemployment rate coupled with a lot of what's being produced not being worth the cover price.

IOW, it's about priorities. I'm underemployed right now. I've been unemployed three times in the past two or so years. I'm trying to start up my own small-time PDF publisher (see link in sig). My bathroom needs remodeling. I've got to wash the algae off the stucco outside the house.

Shelling out money for luxury items like new RPG products is low on my list of things to do.

So, like BOZ said, I soldier on, and get by with what I have.

I agree the economy is a big factor. It may be possible the market is presently flooded with games and there is a watering down effect (but that seems to have been the case for some time).

Another possibility is gaming has made itself more and more niche over the years by codifying its lingo, adopting insider assumptions, etc. Basically, I think games have been more and more tailored for gamers specifically. Less and less for the general public. But it may be a chicken and egg thing, perhaps this is just a recognition of the reality that gaming is niche.

Does anyone have some actual numbers to work with here. Numbers that chart the estimated number of table top gamers from the early 70s to present.

 

[Mallus]

As far as sales being bad, I imagine that's largely due to two factors (at least in the U.S.): the double-digit unemployment rate coupled with a lot of what's being produced not being worth the cover price.

Don't forget there's so much more competition for people's leisure time these days. There just so much more media readily (and cheaply) available now than there was 30 years ago --and there was quite a bit available then, too. Then there's all the new-media augmented socializing like Facebook --which is only, what, 5 years old?-- and Tweeting, or even simply texting friends. Certain gamers like to complain about 'those darn video games' taking away from pen-and-paper gaming time -- that seems quaintly out-of-touch to me.

Every older form of entertainment media has taken a hit recently. For example, network television. There are just so many new games in town.

Sorry if this has already been stressed in the thread, obviously I didn't go back and check. If not, this really should be stressed...