Why did TSR dump Alternity?

[D+1]

Seriously though, this is rather silly. To suggest that a game company would pour thousands of dollars into the design, production, and marketing of a system solely to test its mechanics is utter nonsense.

Not if A) you WANT to test those mechanics on as wide a scale as possible, and B) you can do it and make money at doing it.

TSR poured a lot of money into Alternity for production and marketing. If the game had been a wild success, do you really think they still would have pulled the plug because it was their "plan"?

No - but then if it had utterly tanked they'd have pulled the plug sooner yet.

These conspiracy theories are getting old--when you've been on the Internet as long as I have you hear one too many of them.

Depends, I suppose, on what you think the conspiracy actually is or if there even IS one. I don't think there was any kind of conspiracy to defraud or the like here, but since they HAD hoped to make D&D-scale money with it its understandable why they would nonetheless give it a fixed lifespan because of its experimental nature, and why they would kill it when it had served its ulterior purposes of exploring rules without the added problems of first clapping the far more valuable label of "D&D" on it. Rather than compete with themselves running two SF systems (stardrive vs. star wars) as well as compete with themselves by providing alternity settings that would be re-covered by what eventually became d20, they dropped it and concentrated on the single system that would carry forward.

 

[Ranger REG]

I can buy the US government burning money like that, but a game company? Maybe...

FWIW, there are some comments by Jim Butler on this over at Alternity.net.

Not surprising. TSR was bought not for Alternity but for D&D. I beg to differ with Star Wars RPG (as well as its TCG), since there was a lot of resistance before then, as affirmed by Von Ether's statement. It also can't be helped when they're only allowed to publish a maximum of 7 books a year.

 

[Staffan]

Anyway, I seem to remember Rich Baker or one of the other designers saying that Alternity was sort of a "first attempt" by WotC (it was released one year after the buyout) to design an RPG from scratch, and, well, it shows.

Actually, Alternity was designed before the buyout. It was originally planned to be released in 1996, but due to the Time of Troubles at TSR they delayed it for almost a year after the buyout so they could give it the marketing push they wanted. Well, they did release the limited edition PHB in 1996, but the main product line was released in 1997.

 

[buzz]

I don't think there was any kind of conspiracy to defraud or the like here, but since they HAD hoped to make D&D-scale money with it its understandable why they would nonetheless give it a fixed lifespan because of its experimental nature, and why they would kill it when it had served its ulterior purposes of exploring rules without the added problems of first clapping the far more valuable label of "D&D" on it. Rather than compete with themselves running two SF systems (stardrive vs. star wars) as well as compete with themselves by providing alternity settings that would be re-covered by what eventually became d20, they dropped it and concentrated on the single system that would carry forward.

I can see the grain of truth in the assertion that Alternity was an experiment in as much as any new product is an experiment, and that it was obviously a testing ground (but not a *playtesting* ground) for a possible system to be used by successive editions of D&D. WotC were designing an RPG from scratch for the first time, so they gambled it on Alternity instead of AD&D.

But the implication that WotC knew they were going to pull the plug, *regardless of the game's success*, and develop a wholly new system after Alternity doesn't make any sense. It also doesn't seem to jibe with initial plans for 3rd edition (that it started as just a revised version of 2e; *not* as a system based on the "experiment" of Alternity). It's way too convenient a BBEGC (Big Bad Evil Game Company) conspiracy theory.

What killed Alternity was its perceived lack of success and Lucasfilm dropping the hammer. If Alternity had been a "big hit", D&D would have adopted it (or a revised version of it). None of the comments by the design team that I've ever read have implied otherwise.

If someone can offer actual proof, though, I'll be happy to consider it.

 

[Desdichado]

Or make some very nice, full color hardbacks like Star*Drive or Dark*Matter.

Hmmm. Here's a new theory. Maybe settings with "*" in the middle of the title doom a system.

Well, technically Dark○Matter has more like a, well, a ○ in the middle, not an *. It's just harder to type, since there's no standard key for it.

 

[buzz]

Well, they did release the limited edition PHB in 1996, but the main product line was released in 1997.

The Alternity PHB was released in April 1998. The limited edition came out in 1997, at GenCon. The WotC purchase of TSR was announced in April 1997.

Bill Slavicsek, Lester Smith, and Dori Hein proposed the idea for Alternity in 1995, so yeah, its initial development pre-dates the buyout... which I think is even more reason to believe that there was no plan to kill the game after X years in place, especially seeing as the decision by WotC to revise D&D didn't even occur until after the buyout. Even the suicidal TSR wouldn't spend 2-3 years developing a line it was intentionally going to kill.

I also see no reason why "starter" versions of Alternity (e.g., StarCraft and the Introduction to Alternity starter game, each released about 1-2 years after the PHB) would have been marketed to rope in new players if the intention was to kill the game from the get-go.

It also seems evident that d20 is influenced a lot more by games like Ars Magica, Runequest, and D&D's own tropes than it is by Alternity.

Ergo, I find the whole theory bunk.

I think it simply comes down to the fact that Alternity was basically a good game that got hamstrung by bad business decisions, differing expectations, and the fickle finger of fate.

Thankfully, though, we have d20, which I think is, overall, a better system. Once d20 Future comes out and even more old Alternity content gets converted, we'll have the best of both worlds.

Sources:
http://www.rpg.net/sf/interviews/alternity.html
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/feature/-/99666/002-1718461-4161628

 

[buzz]

Bill Slavicsek, Lester Smith, and Dori Hein proposed the idea for Alternity in 1995, so yeah, its initial development pre-dates the buyout... which I think is even more reason to believe that there was no plan to kill the game after X years in place, especially seeing as the decision by WotC to revise D&D didn't even occur until after the buyout. Even the suicidal TSR wouldn't spend 2-3 years developing a line it was intentionally going to kill.

Just to clarify, this shows that development of Alternity was initiated before anyone at TSR knew that they were going to eventually get bought, which, ergo, pre-dates even the basic conception of a D&D revision and d20 as a system.

Ergo, while designers like Rich baker may say, in hindsight, that Alternity *proved* to be an inspiration for some of the design decisions in d20, it was obviously not *intended* as such. It was intended as a product line, like any other. Unless there were some temporal anomalies involved...

I'm posting in this thread way too much.

 

[Cowpie Zombie]

Just to clarify, this shows that development of Alternity was initiated before anyone at TSR knew that they were going to eventually get bought, which, ergo, pre-dates even the basic conception of a D&D revision and d20 as a system.

Ergo, while designers like Rich baker may say, in hindsight, that Alternity *proved* to be an inspiration for some of the design decisions in d20, it was obviously not *intended* as such. It was intended as a product line, like any other. Unless there were some temporal anomalies involved...

I'm posting in this thread way too much.

[Stands up and cheers]

It feels good to bitch-slap that ridiculous conspiracy theory, eh?

 

[King of Old School]

Game companies extensively test mechanics behind the scene before ever releasing a product; the games are tested by veteran gamers and industry insiders who play hundreds of hours of said game before rendering a judgement. Only then is the game system released.

God, how I wish this were true of all companies and all products...

KoOS

 

[Cowpie Zombie]

God, how I wish this were true of all companies and all products...

KoOS

Come to think of it, Sword & Sorcery *definitely* didn't do this with the new Gamma World books...