Why do people hate Elfkind?

[KingCrab]

They're always up in the trees and stuff causing trouble.

 

[Banshee16]

I like elves... although in 3E terms, I sort of wish they were a high level adjustment race.

Like how the drow are level 11+ foes in 4E. Just do that w/ elves. But, people want to play them, so they had to balance them out...

Why would 3.5 elves need a level adjustment? They're less powerful than other +0 races, such as dwarves....and probably comparable to haflings and gnomes.

Banshee

 

[Brennin Magalus]

Why would 3.5 elves need a level adjustment? They're less powerful than other +0 races, such as dwarves....and probably comparable to haflings and gnomes.

Banshee

I believe the poster wants 3.x elves to be given perks to justify a LA.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

1) Too tall

2) Too serious

3) Too numerous

4) Refuse to make me cookies

 

[Nadaka]

That's my reason, but hate is a strong word.

This was the reason I put down the Eragon books. At the end of the second book I was horrified when

Spoiler

the main character, instead of somehow overcoming all of his human handicaps with wit or perseverance or something else that the underdog always does, he actually has to become an elf to have any chance of winning.

It totally spoiled the series for me and I have no desire to read the third book.

I actually like how they split elves into two races in 4e. It makes them a little less "I'm good at everything and better than you!" It kinda spoiled an idea I had for a campaign setting that revolved around the idea that elves were not all that they seemed. But overall I think it made the game better, so I'm all for it.

Tell me about it. In my campaign world, elves are the unfortunate side effect of an experiment by the ancient necromancer kings. They have a touch of death in them.That is why their con is low, their senses keen, their lives immortal, but unable to withstand the madness of ages. These are all traits they acquired from their touch of death. And they vehemently and religiously deny this fact, to the point that they fake having some mystical connection with nature.

 

[Cryptos]

I would say that the best theory around is the proliferation of elf sub-races: Grey Elf, Moon Elf, Golden or Sun Elf, High Elf, Dark Elf, Wood Elf, Wild Elf, Aquatic Elf, Half-Elf, and so on.

That's enough to give anyone nightmares.

I was happy with the treatment of elves in fourth edition, if only because it was with the understanding that they were front-loading all the elves into the first PHB. I think that someone somewhere from WotC had claimed that the Eladrin and Elves, along with the half-elves and dark elves, would be it for playable elf races, that essentially they were folding the nature aspects into "elf" and the high-minded intelligent fey aspects into "Eladrin", and the evil aspects into "drow", and that would be it.

Whether that remains the case throughout 4e remains to be seen. I spent a lot of time repeating that claim, that this was all the elf we were going to get, before 4e was released, to people that were attacking the fact that already 3/8ths of the races were "elf." So hopefully that remains true.

I guess we'll find out with Forgotten Realms, as I think that's where a lot of the original blame lies for the elf explosion. If that change doesn't carry over to their premiere campaign setting, then a lot of the other elf subraces will probably leak back into 4e as a whole.

 

[Jack99]

So why do people hate the various races of elves (Elves, Eladrin, Drow etc).
Does Tolkien have anything to do with it?

Doubt it. I have read LotR in 3 different languages, and I still love elves, drows, and now eladrin.

For me, they are the quintessential essence of fantasy, along with dragons...

I did hate pretty-boy in the movie though, he just sucked.

 

[blargney the second]

PC race with -2 Con = blargney hates it.

I've got an eladrin warlord in our 4e game, and I'm loving it.
-blarg

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

1. Elf fanboys are the most annoying creatures on earth- makes you want to hate all over the elves.

2. To me personally, elves rub me completely the wrong way. They are flighty, capricious, highly emotional, self-important, self-absorbed, and condescending towards others. I've never seen elves presented in any campaign setting in such a way that they wouldn't be more appealing as spitted and roasting over an orc campfire.

3. Elves are tired and OLD. Everyone and his brother used to play elves, and they are always done the same way in every setting (yes, even Eberron elves are the same insufferable twits).

Oddly enough, I LOVE dwarves. Maybe its because I admire the traits of the dwarves, and the RP possibilities of dwarves aren't so stilted or elitist fanboy power/adulation fantasies.

Odd indeed. Dwarves fit everyy single one of your complaints, after all. They are just as tired and old a concept as elves. Dwarves are a bunchy of greedy, drunken, xenophobic, bitter, miserable jerks who live in crowded dank little s&#t-holes underground. "I've never seen elves dwarves presented in any campaign setting in such a way that they wouldn't be more appealing as spitted and roasting over an orc campfire." Of course, Orcs are the masters of barbeque and can make anything smell good over a fire, so maybe it's just that. And as for fanboys, dwarf fanboys are annoying because they all play out the exact same stereotypes, thinking they're so clever each time. Of course, there aren't even that many dwarf fanboys (see below).

Jealousy.

QFT. The reason so many hate elves is ecause elves as a race are one of the singly most enduring and captivating concepts in all of fantasy, and that just drives some people nuts. In 3E, dwarves were horribly broken and elves a tad weak, yet I still saw far more elf PCs than dwarf ones, even from powergamers. And I'm not counting racial variant elves. core ones alone. Cause the fact is...dwarves are a lame, boring concept, and no matter how much gold paint you place over turd, it's still turd.

As for the "Baskin Robins" argument, this is a lie. Someone on the WotC boards did a count of race variants in 3E, and dwarves ended up having more flavors than elves. So, can we finally drop this insipid complaint?



Whew, ok. Now then, I like Elves. I also like Dwarves. One of my favorite characters was a dwarf cleric that purposefully fit all the dwarf stereotypes (except drinking, none of my characters do that). It's viscerally fun to play the "low charisma, and proud of it!" jerk who's actually a good guy. Just like it's sometimes fun to play the aloof elf wizard who thinks the other races are inferior. I'm just sick of seeing only one of these tropes getting trashed so mercilessly.

 

[Riposte]

While I don't like all of their subraces, my biggest beef with elves would be just how "good" they are at things. This seems to come from Tolkien's original idea of Elves being middle ground between men and gods. It might have worked there, but it doesn't work here.

I don't mean crunch, I mean fluff. Elves (of 3e) are:

1. Attuned with nature. (and fey)
2. Attuned with magic.
3. Live for hundreds of years
4. Highly sophisticated and wise.
5. Some of the greatest archers.
6. Some of the greatest swordsmen(read: warriors).
7. Nimble and swift.
8. Have strong ties with their deity(and pantheon)

It makes me facepalm really.

Of course, this isn't something you can't fix easily.