Why don't I get warm-tingly feelings when I buy a 3E product like in 1E/2E/Basic D&D?

[Mythmere1]

Want the tingle back? I just got it - 38 years old and gamed in all editions, plenty jaded - tried T20 and Deadlands, no big tingle.

If you must stay with 3E, buy Necromancer products. Slight tingle.

To get the real thing, buy Castles & Crusades and ignore the typos. It's like D&D would be if the first edition had just been revised based on a philosophy of lighter rules, but using the best facets of the d20 system.

There is a nostalgia tingle, but the real tingle comes from a sudden rush of creativity about what you can do with these freer-form rules. This is mainly a tingle for DMs. Player options in character development are actually dialed back unless you house-rule some of them back in. The game's based on an archetypal system rather than the pick-and-choose options presented by 3E and GURPS. In consequence, my players complained - but they focused their creative energy on character personality instead of tactical matters, and the result has been a much improved game.

It's not for everyone (the light rules truly change the feel of the game), but at our age, $20 isn't a bad price to see if you revitalize that feeling of open gaming horizons.

 

[woodelf]

I still get that feeling of wonder even when I buy books today, nearly 19 years after I started. Maybe your tastes have changed over the years.

I'll argue that, while my tastes have changed, D&D has changed more. I still enjoy reading AD&D [dunno if i'd like playing at any more], and only recently discovered teh Rules Cyclopedia. The latter gave me the warm tinglies--and not because of nostalgia: i never played D&D, eschewing it in favor of AD&D. I wanted to recapture the feel of [A]D&D badly enough to spend a summer refining and playtesting "Ars Fantasia" (D&D-style high fantasy based on the Ars Magica rules). IMHO, D&D3[.5]E fails to capture that subjective essence of "D&D", and *that* is what i miss.

And i'm apparently not alone. That is apparently much of the point of Castles & Crusades, Blue Rose, and possibly some other projects. A back-burner project of my own is to write a D20 System game that does retain the feel of D&D, while giving the flexibility and consistency of D&D3E. I wonder if it can be done.

 

[Nathal]

Dead, consider looking into Lejendary Adventure Essentials from Troll Lord.

Actually . . . the Castle Zagyg project has got some mildly, tingly feelings perculating.

It's a pitty it won't be *true* Greyhawk -- circa '83. It'll be an alien world that a Greyhawker must extrapolate from.

Also, when Dave Arnesson releases Castle Blackmoor and the City of the Gods, some tingly feelings might stir.

 

[Snowy]

I get excited reading a new book and whenever I put it down someone else from my group will be reading it, almost everyone that comes by will read it avidly. But then Im still fairly young (well sorta) and its my first proper trip through dnd.

edited bit < I have only bought wotc books + arms and equipment and steered away from ones that didnt get good reviews or had appeal to me complete adventurer for my rogue for example>

 

[Geron Raveneye]

I think it's a matter of being really xcitet about what you're spending your money for. I must admit, I wasn't at all tingly when I bought the Core books...they are the basic tools to play the game in it's newer incarnation. But the Manual of the Planes got a few tingles, because I love the 1E version of it.

I felt pretty excited when I finally got a copy of Green Ronin's Psychic Handbook in my hands, and right now I'm anxiously awaiting Bastion Press' Airships...I SO am going to create some skyships for Mystara with that one!

 

[WSmith]

Without citing the merits and drawbacks of any of the editions, there is also some kind of quickening effect. All these companies, all these products, all these websites, many many many of much inundate gamers with massive amounts of stuff. I agree with someone who says much of what material could have been covered has already been done, and some multiple times. It takes away from the mystery when every company does a guide book to elves or hunting manual for dragons.

That, and also, you may be getting old.

 

[Arnwyn]

Is it just that I'm getting older?

Yes, that could be it, but it could also be...

Or is it more than that? Is it that all 3E books are rulebooks?

... this as well.

I know I care little about rulebooks, but I still (yes, still) get the feelings of glee when Dungeon magazine arrives (and also geographical FR books like Shining South).

 

[woodelf]

When I used to buy Basic D&D, 1E AD&D, or 2E AD&D products (early era) my heart would be flushed with these warm tingly feelings and I'd kick my legs in delight as I ripped off the shrink wrap.

Why is it that I don't get that feeling in 3E?

(Actually, to be honest, I started to lose this feeling at the tail-end of 2E -- after the "revised" books where released [those ugly ones with the black covers].)

I enjoy the 3E system and 3E is still clearly "D&D" so the problem doesn't lie in a dissatifaction with the current edition.

Is it just that I'm getting older?

If I were a wee whipper-snapper, would I be getting those tingly feelings (and legs kicking in delight) as I buy the latest 3E product?

Is it just childhood glee that's now lost?

Or is it more than that? Is it that all 3E books are rulebooks? Is that the 3E books just don't "look" as good? Is it that 3E is more "mainstream" now?

I don't know, but I feel like I'm missing something and would like it to return . . .

Well, i don't know why it is for you, and i can't speak for others, but for me, it's because what gave me that warm fuzzy in earlier editions simply isn't there in the current edition, or is overshadowed by other things. I never got a warm fuzzy from new rules, or new widgets (spells, magic items, monster stats, now feats). I got the warm fuzzy from cool new fluff, for lack of a better word. I haven't gotten that feeling from a WotC product since i don't know when. Probably when they last owned Talislanta and Ars Magica. Maybe not since The Primal Order. So, a monster that has a really cool backstory gets me excited. I don't care *what* it's stats are, or even if they're simply a verbatim clone of average goblin stats. And, at least in WotC products, all that cool backstory has been mostly excised from the monsters. Ditto in other areas. I'll get excited about a +1 sword with a 2-page story behind it. A bunch of new magic weapon qualities? *Yawn* And, when i have seen stuff in WotC products that i liked, it was never sufficient to justify the purchase price, nor was it the majority of the pagecount. So while i've seen a fair bit of very cool stuff in WotC books of late, i'm not gonna spend ~$20-$30 for a book that has, say, 20pp that interest me.

I don't accept the notion that i'll simply get jaded with age, and it's inevitable. There is still stuff that fires me up, and it seems pretty similar to what used to fire me up. Sure, it has to be new, but it's the kind of new, not merely the newness, that interests me. So i buy stuff that does fire me up, and don't lament the fact that i'm not buying any WotC books. Frex, i wanted to run D&D, perhaps primarily for nostalgia's sake. So that's what i'm running--but my rulebooks are Arcana Unearthed, Artificer's Handbook, Mystic Secrets, Grimoire II, Fantasy Bestiary, The Book of Distinctions and Drawbacks, Arabian Adventures, and Land of Fate (plus a few bits found online, and a couple magic items from the Everquest D20 GMG).

Really, i don't see anything wrong with not being into the current version of D&D, or not liking a particular publisher's work.

And i wouldn't *expect* your opinion of earlier editions to translate to the new one, because they're significantly different in aims, playstyle espoused, presentation, and look. So if what drew you to D&D in previous versions was any of those, D&D3E isn't likely to "do it for you." As another poster pointed out.

 

[Tyler Do'Urden]

I don't know... for some of us, the "tingles" always came from new *crunch*, not fluff. I remember how exciting it was, in 1998, a year after I started playing (yeah, I know, I'm a youngun), to get my hands on the Player's Option books- Skills and Powers and Spells and Magic especially- WOW! Not kits, but new Core Classes! Crusaders, Monks, Shamans, Artificers, Alchemists, Force Mages, Shadow Mages... this was truly neat stuff. A flexible system for modding classes, point-based skill buying (so you could round out your character more like other skill-based systems)... alternate casting systems (Channelers! I can make Wheel of Time D&D!), complete rules for magic item creation, cool new spells... suffice it to say, I was a happy camper. Nothing made me tingly like those books- not for the "UBER L33T P0W3RGAMING ELEMENT", but because it finally gave me a hard and fast- balanced- system to modify the parameters of my campaign into what I wanted them to be.

But then 3e came out- wow, that was exciting. And then Sword and Fist came out- tingles!... and then the FRCS... more tingles!...

And then it just kind of died.

One of the thrilling parts of Dragon for me in 2e was that it was just about the only source for new rules material (not including fan sites on the net). I'd always eagerly await new rules with options for expanding my games, making my monsters deadlier, systems for various special classes, etc... in 3e, that feeling vanished completely, because rather than searching for water in a desert, I was innundated.

So no, it's not the writing in the books that bothers me (I'm rather fond of how clear and concise everything is, it appeals to my meticulous "simulator" side)... the comic-bookish art and feel isn't my favorite, though other d20 companies and lines don't have this problem (the style of the 3e Forgotten Realms books is probably more the look I would have used for core, but this is mostly a taste issue)...

I just think the problem is too much- WAAAY too much- of a good thing.

A few months back, I finally did something unthinkable- I liquidated my entire collection, keeping nothing but my core books, and decided I'd start fresh. I would only buy books that none of my friends owned, and would actually see frequent use in a game- either in preparation or in play. If I wanted material from other books, I'd borrow. So far, I'm not looking back...