D&D General Why Exploration Is the Worst Pillar

[Swarmkeeper]

You can't logically know your way to a destination that you don't know the location of —you still have to search.

In other words:
“Your group can't become lost except by magical means.”
=/=
You know the exact route to every location in your favored terrain (even if said location has never been seen by humanoid eyes or has otherwise remained undiscovered to date.)

 

[Ristamar]

And what am I targeting by "The servant springs into existence in an unoccupied space on the ground within range"

The closest you can get is that I'm targeting a space... but the servant is appearing, that isn't "targeting" really. I mean, you don't even need to see the space.

The point where it appears/originates is the target. You don't necessarily need to see it, but as the targeting rules state, you must have a clear path to it, so it can't be behind total cover.

 

[Ovinomancer]

You can't logically know your way to a destination that you don't know the location of —you still have to search.

Not if I can't possible not know my way.

 

[Ovinomancer]

In other words:
“Your group can't become lost except by magical means.”
=/=
You know the exact route to every location in your favored terrain (even if said location has never been seen by humanoid eyes or has otherwise remained undiscovered to date.)

Put that way, it does make sense. It is the ranger's favored terrain, so they'd know it very well, right?

 

[Swarmkeeper]

Put that way, it does make sense. It is the ranger's favored terrain, so they'd know it very well, right?

You seem to want to equate “not able to get lost” with “omniscience regarding places they’ve never even seen before.” Because “Favored Terrain”. That’s not how many of us are interpreting that power at all.

 

[Laurefindel]

No, it does make logical sense, it's just an outcome that's unpalatable. I agree this is a very unwelcome outcome, but lost does have that meaning as well, and so the inability to lose one's way means that you know your way. There isn't a middle ground where you haven't lost your way and still don't know it -- not knowing it is what lost your way means.

I agree that this isn't a good way to run the game, I'm just pointing out the absurd results of the rules if taken as they are written. Exploration challenges are extra screwed by a character that should be engaging exploration instead of steamrollering it.

I too believe you're extrapolating too much.

Ignoring how to get somewhere isn't being lost. Being lost is when you can't track your steps back. As long as you know how to go back where you started, you're not lost.

The ranger will always know where (s)he is in relation to their starting point (as long as they are in their favoured terrain, that is). You could even argue that since they can always retrace their steps, they'll never search the same area twice by mistake and thus won't lose efficiency. This they can do intuitively.

However, this doesn't mean that they know how to reach their destination just as intuitively.

It can take me a while before I find Oreo cookies in a grocery store I've never been to. I'm pretty sure I'll always be able to go back to the checkout cashes no matter where I am however. Not knowing where the Oreo cookies are =/= being lost in the grocery.

 

[Ovinomancer]

You seem to want to equate “not able to get lost” with “omniscience regarding places they’ve never even seen before.” Because “Favored Terrain”. That’s not how many of us are interpreting that power at all.

I get that. So, if you don't know the way, that's one definition for lost. You can't be lost. How does this resolve without handwaving it away because it's icky?

 

[Laurefindel]

I get that. So, if you don't know the way, that's one definition for lost. You can't be lost. How does this resolve without handwaving it away because it's icky?

[emphasis mine]
This is the part where others don't agree with you. Your logic is sound. Your base postulate isn't, and therefore skews your conclusion.

 

[Vaalingrade]

I don't think that you have to learn how to do it. You just have to be able to put your shoulder into it, and that's what's specified by a Strength check.

This is explicitly what you have to learn NOT to do.

 

[Faolyn]

This is explicitly what you have to learn NOT to do.

Then that's a good reason to assign some damage to the PC who does it badly.