Why I refuse to support my FLGS

[Mark Chance]

It is completely unethical. You're using false pretenses to waste someone's time. Even if you come in and say "no, I don't need help", you're inflicting wear on materials and taking up space.

This is absurd. So, browsers in a store shopping around for the best price are unethical. That's a good one. "False pretenses." Since a pretense is, by definition, false, would that make a "false pretense" a true motive? More pointedly: Since when did a shopper become morally obligated to make a purchase just by walking through the shop's door? "Inflicting wear on materials"? Equally ridiculous. But here's the cake-taker: "...and taking up space." Ye gods! I take up space everywhere I go! Is there no escape from my criminality?

If you own a store, and don't want people browsing in your store, shrink wrap everything and put up a big sign that says, "You Can Look at It after You've Bought It!"

I bet that'll help sales.

 

[freebfrost]

Saturday I was reminded of one thing that bugs the heck out of me. I had a guy come in my store checking out my board games. I greeted him and asked if he was looking for anything in particular. He said no, that he was just checking out some games he wanted to buy. I said great, just let me know if you need any help. He said he wouldn't, that he be buying them online. And that he wasn't going to pay the retail "ripoff price". I was dumbfounded and in shock. At that moment, I noticed customers at my counter wanting to buy some things, so I had to leave that guy be. He left before I could talk to him again. Okay, so he feels the retail is too high. Fine. But to use a store to check out the product before buying online is just unfair.

So, I take it you don't test drive cars, you just go to a dealer and buy one right?

 

[TheYeti1775]

This is absurd. So, browsers in a store shopping around for the best price are unethical. That's a good one. "False pretenses." Since a pretense is, by definition, false, would that make a "false pretense" a true motive? More pointedly: Since when did a shopper become morally obligated to make a purchase just by walking through the shop's door? "Inflicting wear on materials"? Equally ridiculous. But here's the cake-taker: "...and taking up space." Ye gods! I take up space everywhere I go! Is there no escape from my criminality?

If you own a store, and don't want people browsing in your store, shrink wrap everything and put up a big sign that says, "You Can Look at It after You've Bought It!"

I bet that'll help sales.

Have to agree with Mark on this one, when I'm just browsing I always just say no just looking. My only contention is that when you go on purpose to the store to browse to see if you want to buy it on the net. That would be my problem with it. But if it is just a casual browse and say yea that's cool and bought later. I have no problem with it.

 

[TheYeti1775]

So, I take it you don't test drive cars, you just go to a dealer and buy one right?

Have to point you to my post above and Camp 2.

 

[HeapThaumaturgist]

I think the common, current, theory is that welcoming browsers eventually leads to greater sales. Of course, it needs to be coupled with other incentives.

There are always going to be people who come into a store to browse around. I do it all the time. I don't conciously go into a store to browse a book and then order it online, and I honestly think that's MORALLY wrong. Maybe that's silly, but using somebody else's time and money with no intention toward recompense strikes me as wrong. Browsing doesn't, because I may or may not buy the book and if I'm comfortable somewhere I might very well begin to shop there regularly.

Value-Adds need to be there ... even if you can batch-order some dice and give out a Gamescience die with every RPG book purchase ... something kitchy and not particularly expensive that people don't get when they order online, something that keeps them coming back, like the potential to "collect 'em all" with cool dice or something else of the sort.

--fje

 

[TheYeti1775]

I think the common, current, theory is that welcoming browsers eventually leads to greater sales. Of course, it needs to be coupled with other incentives.

There are always going to be people who come into a store to browse around. I do it all the time. I don't conciously go into a store to browse a book and then order it online, and I honestly think that's MORALLY wrong. Maybe that's silly, but using somebody else's time and money with no intention toward recompense strikes me as wrong. Browsing doesn't, because I may or may not buy the book and if I'm comfortable somewhere I might very well begin to shop there regularly.

Value-Adds need to be there ... even if you can batch-order some dice and give out a Gamescience die with every RPG book purchase ... something kitchy and not particularly expensive that people don't get when they order online, something that keeps them coming back, like the potential to "collect 'em all" with cool dice or something else of the sort.

--fje

Admittly I would be a sucker for freebies.
I love freebies.
Heck open a box of mini's use the commons as promotionals, the others sell as individuals under your glass case. Buy $50 get a free common, buy $100 get 2 free commons and a set of solid dice. It doesn't have to be big, just something nice. And guess what if I just got a mini and I find it cool, you might have hooked me on coming back and buying my minis from you.
I look at like I do one little pizza place I goto. It isn't the greatest but I love it. Want to know the secret, the guys that work there are friendly and customer oriented. The prices are good, not the best I've seen just average. And because I go in there regularly my son(age 5) plays the Ms Pacman arcade game for free. He walks over unlocks it and clicks about 20 credits into it.

 

[freebfrost]

Have to point you to my post above and Camp 2.

Not the point I was making.

My point is that Dristram was complaining because a customer was coming in to check out the product and then purchasing it elsewhere.

To use your example, if Dealer A has the car I want at $5,000 less but has to order it since it is not currently on the lot, but Dealer B has the model I want and its available for a test drive, you can bet I'll go to Dealer B with no intention of purchasing the car to try the car.

It's about trying the product, not the relative comforts or advantages of the store.

Ever take a food sample at a grocery store without any intentions of buying the product? Same thing.

If you are a merchant and feel that customers shouldn't be able to try the product, then take the advice given to wrap everything in shrinkwrap. But, as Mark said, you'll lose customers - personally I never shop at places that do this. As a consumer, I want to be able to try the product. If as a seller, you choose to stop me from checking it out because I may spend my money elsewhere - guess what, I'm already going to be spending it elsewhere.

Finally, TheYeti1775 - which camp would I fall in? I buy books online from Amazon, but I also go to a FLGS where I get a substantial discount. Finally, I go to another FLGS where I pay full price. I buy from all three in fairly equal amounts...

 

[TheYeti1775]

Not the point I was making.

My point is that Dristram was complaining because a customer was coming in to check out the product and then purchasing it elsewhere.

To use your example, if Dealer A has the car I want at $5,000 less but has to order it since it is not currently on the lot, but Dealer B has the model I want and its available for a test drive, you can bet I'll go to Dealer B with no intention of purchasing the car to try the car.

It's about trying the product, not the relative comforts or advantages of the store.

Ever take a food sample at a grocery store without any intentions of buying the product? Same thing.

If you are a merchant and feel that customers shouldn't be able to try the product, then take the advice given to wrap everything in shrinkwrap. But, as Mark said, you'll lose customers - personally I never shop at places that do this. As a consumer, I want to be able to try the product. If as a seller, you choose to stop me from checking it out because I may spend my money elsewhere - guess what, I'm already going to be spending it elsewhere.

Finally, TheYeti1775 - which camp would I fall in? I buy books online from Amazon, but I also go to a FLGS where I get a substantial discount. Finally, I go to another FLGS where I pay full price. I buy from all three in fairly equal amounts...

I would say your in the Camp of Mail my extra cash to Yeti.
I would say you fall into the Camp 9 which somehow I forgot to type in.
Camp 9 - It is a True FLGS

I'm betting the books you buy online from Amazon, generally are not in stock regularly at the FLGS. A true loyal consumer that loves the brick and mortar, and all it represents. I'm also willing to bet you have staff at those stores that do not premate (think that's the right word) the sterotype. Now as you said you get a discount (substansial) at one of them, so I think this falls into it becomes a couple of dollars more camp. With the second FLGS, something about it makes it a Favorite LGS. What is it? Staff, gaming space, browsing? We know it's not price, as you already stated you pay full retail there. Most likely that leads me to believe staff and location.

And please just call me Yeti.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

It is completely unethical. You're using false pretenses to waste someone's time. Even if you come in and say "no, I don't need help", you're inflicting wear on materials and taking up space.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that the act of going in in all cases, browsing knowing you aren't going to purchase right this outing, but are leaving open the chance that you might later is not under this "law"... IMO. Because you do plan on buying it later from the storekeeper who is displaying his product. Most store owners don't even mind and actually expect this.

But going to a store, browsing, knowing before going in there is no chance the storekeeper will be able to sell you something, even if you brush off the hired help saying "don't worry about me, I'm not buying because I buy online from your competitor", this is still unethical. If you want to feel good about yourself and abide by the "law" and still never buy your books from the store, buy the occassional dice set or mini every now and then.

Some might think it is silly to have some ethic guideline with such malleable context. But ethics is all about the context.

 

[freebfrost]

I would say your in the Camp of Mail my extra cash to Yeti.
I would say you fall into the Camp 9 which somehow I forgot to type in.
Camp 9 - It is a True FLGS

I'm betting the books you buy online from Amazon, generally are not in stock regularly at the FLGS. A true loyal consumer that loves the brick and mortar, and all it represents. I'm also willing to bet you have staff at those stores that do not premate (think that's the right word) the sterotype. Now as you said you get a discount (substansial) at one of them, so I think this falls into it becomes a couple of dollars more camp. With the second FLGS, something about it makes it a Favorite LGS. What is it? Staff, gaming space, browsing? We know it's not price, as you already stated you pay full retail there. Most likely that leads me to believe staff and location.

And please just call me Yeti.

It's a variety of things Yeti.

My discount FLGS is the first gaming store that I started frequenting many years ago - the discount is a reflection of just how much money I've spent there in the last 15 years. Most new purchases are made there, but I limit myself to a certain amount weekly that I'll budget for gaming books. Sadly, after the first week or so, this store moves new product off of their "new" shelf space into the "general" shelving. This is bad because their shelves basically suck - they are slanted so that the longer a product sits there, the worse the binding becomes. Otherwise, I do have issues with the place. Staff is not always friendly or quick to help (although being a regular I do not see this issue as much, but I do see it sometimes), I don't really need their services for game space, and cleanliness there is still below average. But I do have a certain loyalty to the place.

The other FLGS is closer to my home, by about 30 minutes for a round-trip. So if I want something ASAP, I'll head here. They have cleaner facilities, nicer shelving, and somewhat friendlier staff.

Since Amazon gets new products later, I typically order "extra" items from them - extra meaning items I wasn't able to fit in my budget. So, if there are 3 new D&D books I want, and only buy two of them, I'll probably play catch-up later on with Amazon and get the missing book.

Now I do fall into the Camp of Disposable Income (aka Mail my extra cash to Yeti), so maybe that makes the difference. Some of it is certainly impulse buying - I see a cool new book at one of the stores, and decide to get it, but I also will shop Amazon for substantial discount items (limited edition PHB, gift sets, bulk purchases for holiday giving, etc).

Maybe I'm just the exception...