Why should I care about the FLGS?

[tetsujin28]

Mine does shrinkwrap some things, but since they own their own machine, they don't mind opening things up for you. And they don't shrinkwrap rpg books -- only boxed sets, minis, and the like.

And seeing as Arcady's LGS (I'll leave out the 'F') is Gamescape in SF, I can side with him. They're kind of a bunch of losers.

 

[BSF]

I just had a rant about my LGS in another thread. If I had a Friendly Local Gaming Store, with a variety of product on the shelves, and knowledgeable, friendly staff, then I would probably give them business. But, when the extent of the staff kowledge about D20 product is "Yeah, um I think I have heard of that." Or, "Well the d20 stuff is over there." If they actually had a good selection of product on the shelves, I might stop by more often. Truth is, my LGS is counting on themselves being the only gig in town and hoping that doing the barest minimum will keep people coming. I have seen them hold a book for a regular, then turn around and have the staff sell the book to a friend who wanted it before the regular arrived. What kind of service is that?

I do not reward poorly run businesses with my purchasing dollars. Period.

 

[Banshee16]

Why should I care about the FLGS? Really, why?

In the 'Eberron rocks' thread there was this off topic note:


I would say yes.

I could say that I'm not a socialist, so sure, let em die... welcome to capitalism - it isn't just about letting the publisher charge your pants off, it's also about undercutting their price whenever you can.

But to look at it another way, why doesn't my local shop go online and compete with the same prices?

A lot of online vendors are themselves small businesses - so the anti-corporate types among us can feel justified there. Many of them sar so small that when you call customer service you can hear the kids watching TV while the person on the phone changes the baby's diaper while taking down your info.

I've been there on that one.

Amazon might be an exception, but it has the Z-Shops which are small businesses who sell the same product as it sells at even better prices.

Small businesses... that still manage to stay in profit and undercut even amazon.

eBay is a giant monolith, but it's one made up of little tiny ants... about as small direct business as you can get.

Again, small businesses that can give me the price I want and stay in profit doing it. On eBay, everything sells for -EXACTLY- what it is worth, at that very moment. No more and no less.

What do I need the local shop for?

A place to game? No, a house provide better privacy.

A chance to learn about gaming? No, the internet gives me that, and no matter how rude the flames I might get - it'll still not only be more polite but look and smell better as well.

A chance to meet fellow gamers? The people who hang out in game stores scare me... They should scare you too, and if they don't, then you scare me.

Sure it's nice to walk in and look at the product, to impulse buy from time to time. It's nice to go in and get a copy of say, Eberron, and not worry about a printing error... But this is after all capitalism we're dealing with, and if the local shop wants to stay, it had better get competitive. Some of those online little guys have no store front, but some of them do.

Now if you're going online and buying it from Walmart then I'm all with those you say you're doing the wrong thing, but not because of the local store issue - I have other reasons for that that would probably violate the rules of this forum against talking about real life...



But if you go online, and you buy it from somebody who's actually got meat attached to their name, or somebody who supports people who do - then I see nothing wrong with you, and I see nothing wrong with your desire to find the best price and, frankly, the superior customer service an online vendor will give (there's a reason for the 'F' in 'FLGS' and it ain't friendly...).

Because I feel like being able to go down to the local shop, browse around, find something I like by flipping through it, and then buy it. Sure, I can send something back to Amazon, but it's a pain in the rear..

Because I find the local bulletin board they have for games useful for finding extra players when necessary. And they haven't been freaks. The only other place useful than that were the directories TSR used to have on their site, but which are no longer there.

Because I want to keep my money closer in the community, rather than some mega corp down in the U.S. Just as I do business with them, they do business with me. I sold a contract for one of my FLGS's to have their entire online presence/e-store done, and it turned out quite well. I buy from them, they buy from me. Good relationship. Won't get that with Amazon or Walmart.

Because said mega corp (ie. Amazon, Walmart) doesn't give two figs about the state of the industry, and will usually focus on best sellers, which really hurts many of the RPG companies in the industry. Because they only focus on these "best sellers", distributors order more of these, which in turn reduces the availability of the smaller print run books......this in turn is bad because it can play havoc with distribution networks.

So, although I buy maybe 15% of my books from Amazon, the rest all come from my local stores.

Banshee

 

[Greylock]

Whole-heartedly agree on the browsing. And when I want to buy something, I want it NOW, not next week. That, and my overall experience with online shopping has been subpar. Even when so-and-so has what I want and ships on time, it invariably ends up on my well traveled stoop on a rainy day.

Also, in regards to advice and such... When I decided to re-enter the gaming world I went around my FLGSs. One suggested that I visit a local gaming forum. Through that group I re-upped with old friends and found myself gaming again. Through the course of those gaming sessions I discovered ENWorld. Another shop managed to actually have a ton of books that were names only to me online. ENWorld titles, too. Bought some that I never would have gotten online. Why? No longer available.

Thank you, Kevin's Attic and thank you Comic's and Collectables...

 

[Banshee16]

I'm basically with arcady on this one. The point about "incidentals" is good, but the price difference between Amazon, for example, and my FLGS is pretty wide - $10 on the Complete series. That's a high premium to pay for a potential convience, in my view.

The best thing about FLGSs is being able to browse product - assuming yours doesn't shrink wrap every volume. Mine does this, so no browsing. In fact, Amazon provides a "Search Inside the Book" function that allows you to see selected, limited, or all pages of a volume (try Complete Warrior for an example of this). So I can browse the materials online now, where locally I cannot.

I know there's a need and desire for local hobby shops, it's just not my need or desire, and it is the responsibility of the stores themselves to adjust to a market space shared with online competitors.

The "Search within the Book" isn't offered on nearly all of the books at Amazon though.

It's too bad if you don't have a good game store with knowledgeable staff. Maybe I'm spoiled. My favorite has great staff who know everything that's coming in, know what's going on with the publishers, and have a generally decent idea of most of the products, and they're friendly. And they don't shrink wrap the books. Usually, I go down, and I can spend 40 minutes flipping through 8 different books, then I buy one or two. No problems.

Banshee

 

[der_kluge]

You know, I don't know why I buy from my FLGS, I just do. There are a couple in town, and one doesn't have any kind of discount on their book, so you pay the listed price. I did that once, and I'll go to the other one instead now.

But, I've bought books at my favorite LGS, and then thought later, "I could have saved $15 getting this off Amazon.com". I don't know why I don't. I can't think of any books I absolutely, positively had right at the moment.

I do like going in the bookstore, because they are very knowledgable. I can ask about miniature painting, or get a vibe on what other gamers are talking about, or reading. So, there's a community thing kind of going on there.

Plus, the biggest point is the return policy. I bought a miniature dragon there, and got it home and realized that it had two left legs. I took it back, and without even signing any piece of paper, he just let me exchange it for another one. That was definitely easier than buying it online. I've had that happen with two different dragon miniatures, so I would recommend purchasing such things from an FLGS.

Eberron would be another good example - since a good number of them appear to have a printing error, sending it back to Amazon would be a pain in the rear had you purchased it online.

 

[Napftor]

It really all depends on the specifics of the FLGS. If the place is clean, staff knowledgeable (or at least friendly), and products you want available, then go to them. If not, or a nice place isn't local for you, then the net's resources are your best bet. There's no right or wrong answer to the question. It's all relative. Personally, one of the things I like about a FLGS is that the book I got is guaranteed to get to my home without the mail delivery system destroying it.

 

[AIM-54]

Aside from the fact that my FLGS owner is a good friend, and that we use the store on Wednsdays to play Living Greyhwak (not sure where else 20+ roleplayers would go...), I am reminded of my patience, and the Good/Fast/Cheap rule:

You can have it good and cheap, but it won't be fast.
You can have it fast and cheap, but it won't be good.
You can have it good and fast, but it won't be cheap.

It might be cheaper to order online, but when I decide to buy a book, I want it now, not some time in the future, relying on, heaven-forbid, the postal system to get it to me. I sell stuff on eBay, but I almost never buy. Funny, that.

Yes, but you have the misfortune of relying on Canada Post which is incredibly inferior to USPS in my experience (I grew up in Saskatoon). At least in terms of getting things from one place to another at anything considered a fast rate. A few months ago I ordered "Cry Havoc" off Amazon and it was in my greedy little hands within 4-5 days. Living in/near a major city may have something to do with that however.

The best thing about LGS', in my opinion, is the browse factor. I love browsing through the shelves just to see what's there, whether or not I have any intention of buying. And, at least in this area, complaining about the lack of Shadowrun books.

I've never been much of collector of books, though, so the browse factor is way more important for me...and browsing Amazon has nowhere near the same feel.

 

[wizardneedsfood]

I don't have a FLGS. When I'm at school I have an LGS but like the thread starter said, the people there tend to be really creepy. Like people who get really upset about Ewoks being able to be Jedi and people who wear VtM jewlery. Interesting folk. They have a decent selection, but nothing spectacular. I do shop their on occasion, picked up Mutants and Masterminds there and HERO 4th edition.

However, I'd much rather buy things online, where I can save a good bit of money and with Amazon my stuff has always arrived within 3 days of ordering. Usually a day or two before the estimated arrival time.

What is even better for me is buying things at a bookstore. With membership cards you save at least 10% off the book and get other perqs.

 

[Kaleon Moonshae]

I don't know about this one, so many "f"LGS that I have had to deal with over the years have been kind of snobbish if they didn't know you "personally" or you weren't there to buy the newest ccg. The one in college would give their valued customers (read friends) a 10-20% discount and then mark everything else up accordingly so that you were often paying *more* than listed price. The one here in Austin is nice enough but they have never attempted to engage me in conversation other than to say "can i get something for you?" or "going to be buying that?" and that isn't what I think of as friendly. The game store I grew up with would actually *talk* to you if you stopped in more than once a month. He made sure he knew your name if you stopped in more than twice a month. I get tired of all this "save the flgs" ranting I hear sometimes. A store is a store is a store, the people are what make it special. If you have someone local who cares about you and values you then buy there, if not get it wherever you can.

my two cents