Why the fear and hatred of Disjunction?

[Jhulae]

This analogy doesn't work. You need to devise one where all four of you throw the entire combined $200 million weight of your "estates" to grow them (exponentially, by the DMG tables). With that in mind, combining resources to make up for a $40 million shortfall (and not in some stock market anomaly but as a cost of doing business) does not seem farfetched....because most people play Good PCs? Apparently not you?

Even good PCs vary.

A group of LG PCs might not care about having a 'communal wealth pot' or whatever, where they make sure the one PC who lost a lot gets something from the rest.

But, Chaotic PCs, even good ones, care more about themselves than the group.

 

[Endur]

Clone will not avoid the effects of losing all spellcasting ability. I think a spellcaster would have to be more than a little desperate to ever use MD.

Absolutely. I think a spellcaster would only use this spell if he thinks he is going to die in a non-recoverable manner if he does not use it.

 

[Endur]

Agreed.

Multiple Relics, maybe. Multiple Artifacts being carried around by the PCs? Not in any game I've ever been in or heard of.

I have.

Fragarach. Check.

Deck of Many Things. Check.

Orb of Oblivion. Check.

Orb of Silvery Death. Check.

Book of Vile Darkness. Check.

Talisman of Pure Good. Check.

And all of those from a published adventure that is levels 4-12.

There are lots of artifacts out there. Many of which have very minor powers or are plot devices that the PCs can not take advantage of (like The One Ring).

 

[Infiniti2000]

And all of those from a published adventure that is levels 4-12.

It's 4-14 and Fragarach isn't actually in the module. Otoh, you missed one or two.

 

[billd91]

Here's my thought, what NPC wizard wouldn't use it?

Sure I'm going to destroy some loot. Big whoop, if I'm killing a party anywhere near to my CR I'm still raking in a whole lot more magic than I could get anywhere else, and lowering my risk factor by leaps and bounds. Even if I don't kill your most precious items your buffs are zeroed, making it a better fight in my favor.

Buffs may be zeroed out (assuming the party even had time to set any up before the confrontation) but taking out the party's strongest items is a dicey gamble. You might get their powerful stuff and you might not. You're certainly going to anger them and they're going to come up with some form of counter measures for the next confrontation.

Using the disjunction spell is a powerful strategy, but not always a dominant one.

 

[Stalker0]

Buffs may be zeroed out (assuming the party even had time to set any up before the confrontation) but taking out the party's strongest items is a dicey gamble. You might get their powerful stuff and you might not. You're certainly going to anger them and they're going to come up with some form of counter measures for the next confrontation.

Using the disjunction spell is a powerful strategy, but not always a dominant one.

At high levels, what is a better one? Remember its not just buffs, even if you don't destroy the permanent items they all get turned off for a few rounds. Think of how much hp damage you do just by lowering the enemies con scores, how much DR you gain from lowering their damage, how much higher your saves are because the enemies spell DCs are much lower, and how much higher your spell DCS are becasue teh enemies saving throws how been greatly lowered. Heck it might be possible you prevent enemy casters from retaliating with 9th level spells if their unmagiced intelligence isn't high enough (unlikely but possible).

 

[Endur]

At high levels, what is a better strategy?

Anti-Magic is a far better strategy than Mord's Disjunction.

Some party members will have very high will saves and their buffs and magic items will survive mostly intact (Clerics, Paladins, etc.). For other PCs, they'll still have some surviving items.

Anti-Magic, however, means none of their magic items and spells work. Far more optimal because it is predictable. You can count on anti-magic to get the job done.

Furthermore, if you win, you can steal the PCs stuff. With Mord's disjunction, you might have wiped out the treasure you wanted to steal.

As a GM, I've never bothered to use Mord's Disjunction. I've used Anti-Magic many, many times.

Also, Blasphemy from a caster with a high enough caster level is more powerful than Mords. I used Blasphemy once to strip a party of all of their magic items. (Paralyzed the whole party, looted the party, took all their stuff, and through them in a prison).

 

[KarinsDad]

Also, Blasphemy from a caster with a high enough caster level is more powerful than Mords. I used Blasphemy once to strip a party of all of their magic items. (Paralyzed the whole party, looted the party, took all their stuff, and through them in a prison).

Yeah, this sounds reasonable. No save and most PCs do not have a decent enough Spell Resistance to bother a caster 5 or more levels higher.

DM: "I didn't feel like gaming tonight, so all of you are paralyzed, no save. Oh and even though it is an evil spell, I don't feel like playing the bad guy as evil, I'll just take your stuff and throw you in prison so that you don't lynch me."

 

[Infiniti2000]

Anti-Magic is a far better strategy than Mord's Disjunction.

Many people (myself included) feel that AMF is broken (at its level), too. We hattesss it!

 

[Infiniti2000]

DM: "I didn't feel like gaming tonight, so all of you are paralyzed, no save. Oh and even though it is an evil spell, I don't feel like playing the bad guy as evil, I'll just take your stuff and throw you in prison so that you don't lynch me."

Well, quite honestly, there are things worse than death. Especially in D&D. But, it depends on how vile a campaign you want to run and how mature your players are. Although, that's a conundrum because the less mature your players are, the less likely that you would want to kill off their PC's with an almost guaranteed TPK.

But, blasphemy is clearly broken in 3.5 and it really really should be house ruled (as with all the other three similar alignment spells).