Why the hate for anime? (Y da hat 4 anime?)

[Alzrius]

My natural inclination is to like something, and anime falls firmly for me into this mode of thinking. To be fair though, I probably can't be too objective about this (discovering anime pretty much gave me my focus in life, since it got me interested in Japanese culture, leading me to eventually major in Japanese Studies, so I regard it quite highly), just so you know.

I think one of the first problems here is an inability to define exactly what anime is. It's not a medium (the medium is animation), it's not a style (because we see various shows that are all called "anime" that look wildly different...compare Crayon Shin-chan to Crying Freeman), and it isn't location-based (since we see "American anime" or at least anime-style shows from America, such as Teen Titans).

That said, I simply don't understand how anyone can categorically dislike anything when it covers a multitude of genres...the fact that it has such diversity means that, even statistically speaking, there should be something that appeals to you. Think of whatever kind of movie you like, and there should be an anime with exactly those same qualities. Saying that one dislikes all anime doesn't make sense, simply because you haven't seen all anime, so there's a significant portion of it you're passing judgement on with virtually no knowledge of. Is it too over the top? Watch something that's about normal people with no action, like Maison Ikkoku. Don't like episodic format? Watch something where the episodes don't build on each other, like Cowboy Bebop. There is something out there for every taste.

I have things that I "hate" categorically, across all boundaries. For example, you'll never catch me playing a game on any console that wasn't made by Nintendo. However, I recognize that this is a personal foible - that this is my own unreasonableness coming into play here. There are plenty of great games on the PS2 and X-box that I'm sure I'd love - heck, Ive seen games for them that weren't for Nintendo that I want to play, but never will. That's me just being me - I've made up my mind and won't change it. Sounds like the same thing for the anime-haters, except some still seem to want to believe that it's the anime, and not them.

 

[burnrate]

There are several posts in this thread already stating that anyone who hates anime is ignorant or something to that effect, which seems to me, in itself, an extremely ignorant statement. Hate is a strong word, not one I would use, but I do very much dislike all of anime art I've seen. So much so that it would ruin any aspect of a story or any entertainment value associated with a particular movie, show, or book. I don't like the hair, eyes, mouths, legs, bodies, weapons, color schemes or anything else about the art. It doesn't appeal to me.

Does that make me ignorant? Does it mean I must like nascar or American television (I don't and don't)? What an ignorant thing to say! The art of anime, although I'm sure it varies across the genre, is so pervasive as to make the whole impossible to enjoy if it isn't art that appeals. The stories may be great. I'll never know.

No, I don't only attribute my perception of the art to yu-gi-oh and pokemon, although those are so widespread they can't help but influence a perception. I see the art in video stores, on comic books, in game shops, on t-shirts, and on various other places. I don't know to which series they belong. I only know that collectively I don't like the art.

I have no issue with those of you who do. Continue to enjoy. Don't think someone who doesn't think the same of the genre is an idiot however, as I've read in the above posts. It's like telling someone they are an idiot or ignorant because they don't like tomatos.

 

[Nuclear Platypus]

Oh yeah. If you can find it, Robot Carnival was several shorts. The one I liked the most was the giant robot battle (one was coal powered while the other ended up being pedalled!) in feudal Japan.

 

[Caspian Moon Prince]

You've really got your labels mixed up. Cartoon is an animated video medium. Anime is a cartoon. Manga is not anima, manga is manga. Which is also not a medium, as it's a style of comic book.

Or do you have them mixed up? As I said before, anime is as much a cartoon as Heavy Metal is a cartoon. A cartoon is an animated show that is humorous in nature and mostly for children. While anime can be humorous or for children, it can also be neither. Neon Genesis Evengelion is not humorous or for children, neither is Vampire Hunter D.

A medium is the way through which something is transfered. That medium for both cartoons and anime(which are both different) is animation. Or if you prefer to be more generalized than that TV, movie, OAV, etc.

You are correct manga is not anime, I did not mean to refer to it as anime. If that was how it came off then that was a mistake on my part.

 

[Creamsteak]

I also spied a Final Fantasy anime at Target, but I was too afraid to pick it up. Does it do my beloved game series justice? Or are my fears founded?

It's not very good. It's sort of interesting, but the whole time I couldn't wrap my mind around why I was watching this besides the fact that Final Fantasy was in the name.



That said, my opinion is that some anime series and movies are pretty cool, but most of it is just as bad as a trashy romance novel or a soap opera. Not saying they are all that similar, but I'd put them at about the same level. My favorites have always been the mecha, cyberpunk, and other science fiction stories. Probably because I just love that. But the fantasy, with the exception of a few like Lodoss Wars, has been pretty tame and uninteresting. And the other genres just don't bite me as interesting (what's with the magical girl series and the stupid series where the entire cast might have super-powers, but basically they are all just angsty little children?)

 

[beta-ray]

Part of the "hate" is a real age gap I can see -- I can't think of anyone I know who's 30 or older that actually likes anime; everyone I know that likes it distinctly falls below that line, even if only by a few years. Much as many from the younger generation loathe hair metal and other music from the 80's, many from the older generation look at what the younger generation is into and wonder what the hell the kids are thinking.

*Raises hand meekly* Uhm... I am now past the mid 30 mark and I like "anime" maybe more than I did before. I was raised on both Japanese and American animation... Luckily I was able to watch many Japanese cartoons with the original Japanese dialogue with subtitles. Sadly much the animation that is imported now is dubbed badly. Although we had Astro Boy here, my love for Japanese animation started with Mazinger Z. For American animation it was probably Flintstones, Milton the Monster, Fearless Fly and the Mighty Heroes. Oh I liked the Marvel stuff from the 60s too.

Dragon Ball Z seems to be considered to be a the representative of anime (Cartoon Network advertising it as the greatest show on Earth didn't help). DBZ is a terrible show, and a terrible representative of anime, especially of the newer stuff. Cowboy Bebop and Trigun make much better representatives than the bulk of what Cartoon Network has run.

I don't care for Dragonball Z at all, though I did like the early episodes of Dragonball. Regarding Toriyama, I much prefer Dr. Slump. I liked Cowboy Bebop and Trigun too.

Saikano and The 12 Kingdoms are even better representatives, but there's no way in hell Cartoon Network would ever run those.

Well I never thought they'd bring over FLCL... but they did! (like that wacky show as well)

Much of the things I've seen people complain about in this thread tend to belong to the older, low-budget shows.

I don't think that the age of a show or it's budget necessarily have anything to do with the quality of a show... Many of the shows that I like are older and had a smaller budger than shows of today.

A lot of it, is due to my nostalgia I admit. I still think shows like Raideen and Getter Robo are cool. Just pure fun. I also like Zeta Gundam the best out of the Gundam stories even though the main character can be a bit of a pill.

Some random stuff I thought were good that were "anime" (not mentioned previously)... Robot Carnival (robot anthology stories)... The Hakkenden ("Eight Dog Tales" Buddhist Samurai story)... Giant Robo (over the top pulp action)... Raxhephon (people compare it to Evangelion... but funny I didn't really care for Evangelion)... Yukikaze (released recently in the USA, air force-type story)... Macross Plus (prequel to Macross or Robotech part I in the USA, not released here yet)... Spirited Away... Patlabor 2 (slow but interesting and not what most people would view as "anime art")... Blood... Jin Roh... Gosh I am sure there are tons I haven't mentioned...

Japanese animation I agree with others on (being good): Akira, Ghost in the Shell, Ruroni Kenshin, Escaflowne, Wolf's Rain...

Stuff I want to see... Last Exile, Ghost in the Shell: Man Machine Interface, Ghost in the Shell: Innocence, and more I can't think of right now...

 

[Alzrius]

I also spied a Final Fantasy anime at Target, but I was too afraid to pick it up. Does it do my beloved game series justice? Or are my fears founded?

There are two Final Fantasy anime - Final Fantasy: Legend of the Crystals, and Final Fantasy: Unlimited.

Legend of the Crystals is a four-episode OVA that takes place two hundred years after Final Fantasy V. Here's a brief review that should roughly sum up the relevant information about it.

Final Fantasy: Unlimited (which I haven't seen yet) is best reviewed here: What is Final Fantasy: Unlimited?

Finally, although it isn't really an anime, Final Fantasy: Advent Children is the CGI sequel to Final Fantasy VII, not yet released in Japan (and thus, not anywhere else either). It's set, from what I vaguely recall from the rumors, two years after the game. The homepage has a few trailers.

 

[Dark Jezter]

The worst thing about Anime in general is the Fans themselves....

And many would agree that anime isn't that bad, but there's quite a major problem with the most hardcore anime fans, the otaku in general. They're among the worst types of geeks ever. They're horribly annoying, painful to be around, and completely socially inept.

 

[beta-ray]

See, that's just plain ludicrous. First of all, television is the media, anime is a visual and storytelling style that encompasses many genres. But saying that anime non-fans can't get their heads around anime because it addresses all genres of television is just plain wrong. That's like saying we can't get our heads around television because it has so many genres. It's a completely ludicrous position to take, and that's why I don't like ill-concieved anime fans that show up and pretend like anime's something really special when all it is is a style of animation and storytelling. Because anime is just a style, I find it perfectly acceptable to say "I don't like that style, therefore I don't really like anime" without some half-assed excuses about "I just can't get my head around anime, because it's just so rich and expansive and special, like an episode of Blossom." :rolleyes, damn I've missed you today:

Television is the media... but so is radio... and other venues. Television is the medium for animation though. Some people do not like television at all and would rather read. While I probably would not say that you "cannot get your head around" anime, I might say that you cannot accept it for some reason. It does pain me to think of anime as a style because there are so many variations in this one style. Do you feel that American animation is a style of animation? If so, then that's cool because at least I could understand it even if I don't agree with it.

Although I must say your condescending attitude about this topic does make it difficult to keep my opinions level. My apologies if that is insulting, perhaps both our attitudes are a result of the way online conversations take place.

Save it, pal. I've really tried to like anime. I know a lot of people that like a lot of other things that I do that swear by it, so I've watched a lot of the highly recommended ones.

Did you really try to like it? That could be a plus or a minus (perhaps the expectations were too high?)... And I would never try to make you or anyone like anime as I would not want someone to make me try to like American Idol... but I wonder if you really meant that you tried or only that you watched it.

The best I can say for them is that the best of the genre is mediocre -- and by far that is the exception.

Now it's a genre? I don't know if you have watched "the best"... I can't even say I have. But I have watched many I have liked... and many I have not liked.

Regardng other commentary that you have made... I am not sure if you have to be Japanese to like "anime" (again it pains me to say it since it really is only animation made in Japan... like I rarely call it American animation or British animation or French animation UNLESS I am making a direct comparsion)... I am in fact Japanese. However, I am a third generation Japanese, and even though I have been exposed to many things that are Japanese, I have also been exposed to many other cultures. I also like some Kung-Fu movies and Hong Kong movies, but I am not Chinese... I like D&D and I am not European... I am interested in things Japanese though so maybe it is hard for me to see out of it even though so many Japanese animated shows try to portray things outside of a Japanese context, it is almost impossible for no cultural influence to seep in. *shrug*

 

[beta-ray]

Hey Dark Jezter, would you happen to have any pics of those renaissance fair guys... or babylon5 convention fans... or those guys in the stands at football games in early february...?