Wizards: Musings on the new DDi disaster

I totally and completely disagree.

There are a lot of gamers without DDI subs that have never used the CB, and there are groups that don't bother with it because of the number of house rules and options they use, and there are groups that just don't use it because they just plain don't even if they do have a DDI sub.

I know that sounds absurd, but I have been in groups of all three of those descriptions. In fact, when I run a game at the place my current group usually plays, I have banned the CB during sessions since the host's computer is like 80 years old and it takes him literally over an hour to update a character.

And there are people (raises hand) who got tired of the endless parade of splat books, precisely because it was too difficult to try and keep up in 3.0/3.5. Not to mention the cost. With the same likely in 4e, the presence of CB was a Godsend.

You don't NEED to use CB and you don't NEED the umpteen million additional books but, truth be told, you don't NEED to play 4e either. Pointing at needs, in order to invalidate people's opinions regarding how they spend their disposable income, is rather pointless, no? We're talking about preferences and desires, not needs.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

First, your understanding of American Copyright law is......shall we say extremely limited and inaccurate.

Secondly, gaining a player who isn't a customer is useless to them. As long as you aren't a potential buyer, your opinion means essentially nothing.

Thirdly, it would be shocking, and shockingly stupid (and impossible) for them to get cleared through any channels. There would be no hype build-up, not marketing campaign AND they would be giving away their new content for "essentially" free to every subscriber.
1. I'll leave Copyright stuff to Danny, he's better suited for arguing the points out.

2. Gaining a player who isn't a customer isn't useless in all cases. I still pick up the new book and check it out at the local store to see if something really catches my attention with it. In cases like mine it gives them a potential. What if my groups version of 4e runs well to my likely. That in turn increases the likely hood of me purchasing 4e products. Everyone is a potential buyer, it is a question to what degree.

3. Psst it was sarcasm to the extreme. Mainly illustrating the point, as an online tool it actually offers less long term value than the older on the PC version. IMHO, YMMV.

Doesn't 3.5 still have PCGen? I've never liked it's interface, but the program works. (And isn't it available for Pathfinder?)
GURPS has a couple of them. A commercial one for GURPS 3 and new commercial one for GURPS 4 and a free java one for GURPS 4.

PCGen does do pathfinder. I'm looking at it now, and thinking of diving into the code.
If your diving into the code look up the Yahoo groups on PCGen. They are regularly making changes to the code and all discussing it. I get emails everyday about it since I joined them.

The problem with PCGen, isn't if it works or not. It's in Data use.
It's not officially supported by WotC and is limited (unless you happen to have the old datasets) to the SRD and what you input yourself. If someone were to say make a fully usuable version of Cityscape and put it into PCGen than pass it along to a friend they would technically be violating rules/laws whatever.


I wanted to clarify this a bit:
Gotta spread the XP around. Thanks for the clarifications Danny.

Going web with the CB looks like a desition made to please the higher ups (we are doing something about piracy, see!?) instead of the costumers.

Which is really really stupid of course.
There is a high possiblity that is a correct assumption.
But I don't think that's the case in this one.
There have been numerous threads on the Character Builder prior to this change, where members of here such as myself talked of using the CB downloaded via a subscriber because we were in the same group. While not heavily encourcaged on the WotC side, neither is it a 'frowned on activity'. Much like someone that pops a grape into their mouth in the checkout line before it's weighed and paid for. Sure by law it's theft, but it's also morally gray. WotC I'm quite sure took into account that groups would share it within themselves.

Putting it to an online status I equate more to the 'bait and switch'.
How many 'subscribers' are subscribers just because of the Character Builder and it's updates? Was there anything else as a subscriber that was worth the monthly cost?

The real test of this move won't be anything in this thread. It will be how many current subscribers pre-announced change, renew their subscriptions.
If there is a net gain, WotC made the correct decision. If not, they made the wrong one.

One positive thing, I could say for it being online is it will allow an easy metric of how much Players/DMs use the Character Builder as an online tool. This in turn will allow them to easily justify their spending in electronic support.
You have to be vocal in your feedback though. Just saying it crashes doesn't help. It especially won't help convince someone (like myself) to subscribe for it. Give details of what you did, time/date it occurred, any screenshots, and what browser/system you were using at the time. Send that report into WotC.
We want them to improve, give them the feedback they need without the Raging Rant to go with it.
 

Secondly, gaining a player who isn't a customer is useless to them. As long as you aren't a potential buyer, your opinion means essentially nothing.

I disagree with you on this point. Having more people that play means that there is more of a reason for those that do pay to keep buying books and content. Also, indirect sales could be shaped by the non-purchaser's desires:

DM who buys all the books: "What do you guys think about playing Dark Sun?"
Player who doesn't: "I don't know, what is it about?"
DM: [explains]
Player: "That sounds AWESOME! I'd love to."
DM: "Cool, I'll pick up the campaign setting tonight!"

Or
Player: "No way. I'd love to ride around on dragons and stuff, though."
DM: "Okay... Dear WotC, Please re-do a DragonLance campaign. My players want it."

Anyone who is not currently a customer who could be, directly or indirectly, should be listened to. Ignoring potential customers is a bad business decision.
 

I disagree with you on this point. Having more people that play means that there is more of a reason for those that do pay to keep buying books and content.
Sometimes. I, many of my friends, and most of my GMs, will only buy new books when they feel they NEED them. EX: I joined a game a couple weeks back and the DM said: "You can play anything you want, if you have the book it comes from." As he only had the PHB1, DMG1, and MM1. I felt it was totally reasonable for him to NOT need to buy a new book just because we wanted to play something he didn't have a book for.


Anyone who is not currently a customer who could be, directly or indirectly, should be listened to. Ignoring potential customers is a bad business decision.
Yes, anyone COULD be, you're illiterate, fantasy-hating cousin COULD be a customer, but it is incredibly improbable that they WILL.

But I think the point that was trying to be made is that person in particular, even when given free materials, showed NO desire to buy product. Ignoring people who say "I want to buy your product, but I'd like X too" is a bad idea. Ignoring people who say "I will only buy your product if you kiss my toes" is a good idea.

Unreasonable demands are, unreasonable.
 

I want to state that it's the height of entitlement when paying customers outright demand that the products they are given work and function properly when they receive them after paying for it.

And it's not the customers that're acting entitled.
 

Come on folks. You know this isn't about piracy. This is about funneling people into Essentials by removing access to the plethora of well written rules and options that precede it. It's the same kind of field-salting that followed the release of 4e (removal of PDFs), to encourage switching to the newest edition. Because that's what Essentials is, after all. The newest edition of D&D. Surprise and Merry Christmas!:)

Stop trolling, please. ~ PCat
 
Last edited by a moderator:

I think the only people that think Essentials, the new character builder, and WotC marketing are failures are people that like to gripe on message boards.

When they try to sell the new CB better as more portable and it doesn't work properly on my Windows 7 (1200x600 res, silverlight on), yup, it's a huge marketing failure for me.

As 4E starting marketing was a total failure.

I think the only people who think the new CB and Wotc marketing are not failures are diehard Wotc fans.

I like 4E, but not to the point of closing my eyes and applaud every Wotc move...
 

I have probably played with the online CB for approx 10 hrs or so. I have created probably 40 to 50 characters (printed them to pdf to avoid the 20 character limit). I have crashed the builder 3 times. Each time was when I was importing a character from the old character builder.

I am running Windows 7 on my laptop with this. I have used Chrome, IE 9 and Firefox with the builder. It has worked fine and has worked quickly for me.

So I wish I could respond to those that are having problems.

[MENTION=86638]Chrono22[/MENTION] I am hoping that your comment was routed in sarcasm. Because I can create a character for 4th edition that doesnt use the Essentials rules at all.
 

I'm always amazed people keep talking about Essentials as going after new players.

Unleless I'm missing something, it's going after old players. Lapsed players. Changing spells and how classes like the fighter work to mimic old rules are NOT designed to get new players.

But I've been wrong before so no skin off my nose.

Me? I love the Warlock Hex Blade build. A striker fighter mage that seems to work. I'm dying to play one but my main character just refused to die.
 

Come on folks. You know this isn't about piracy. This is about funneling people into Essentials by removing access to the plethora of well written rules and options that precede it. It's the same kind of field-salting that followed the release of 4e (removal of PDFs), to encourage switching to the newest edition. Because that's what Essentials is, after all. The newest edition of D&D. Surprise and Merry Christmas!:)

How do you know it isn't the other way around?
 

Remove ads

Top