D&D 5E Wizards Should Hire Paizo

[Ravenheart87]

Like what? I mean, lots of people say this, but while they are happy to say what they don't want there aren't a lot of examples of what they do.

A few examples for sandbox adventures I'd like to highlight:

• Isle of Dread (BECMI D&D)
• Frandor's Keep (HackMaster)
• Doom of the Savage Kings (DCC RPG)
• Thieves of Fortress Badabaskor (OD&D/D&D3e)
• Death on the Reik (WFRP)

Many classic D&D modules are also standalone, location based adventures without intended script or player behaviour. There are places, people, conflicts, you drop in the PCs, and see how it unfolds - the story writes itself and evolves from player action.

 

[Bayonet]

I agree with the push for some "sandbox" adventures. I would happily play for some small adventures I could use as stand alone sessions, or work into a larger campaign. I am a lot less excited to pay for things that are essentially system bloat.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

A few examples for sandbox adventures I'd like to highlight:

• Isle of Dread (BECMI D&D)
• Frandor's Keep (HackMaster)
• Doom of the Savage Kings (DCC RPG)
• Thieves of Fortress Badabaskor (OD&D/D&D3e)
• Death on the Reik (WFRP)

Many classic D&D modules are also standalone, location based adventures without intended script or player behaviour. There are places, people, conflicts, you drop in the PCs, and see how it unfolds - the story writes itself and evolves from player action.

That is pretty much what I'm interested in.

 

[Staffan]

A few examples for sandbox adventures I'd like to highlight:

• Isle of Dread (BECMI D&D)
• Frandor's Keep (HackMaster)
• Doom of the Savage Kings (DCC RPG)
• Thieves of Fortress Badabaskor (OD&D/D&D3e)
• Death on the Reik (WFRP)

Many classic D&D modules are also standalone, location based adventures without intended script or player behaviour. There are places, people, conflicts, you drop in the PCs, and see how it unfolds - the story writes itself and evolves from player action.

I'd like to see a semi-sandbox like Paizo's Souls for Smuggler's Shiv. The adventure starts out with the 1st level PCs shipwrecked on an island, and they have to figure out a way to get off. This involves exploring the island and learning several things about it, such as why so many ships are wrecked here and how to stop that from happening, as well as figuring out what's up with the cannibals, and dealing with the person responsible for their shipwreck in particular.

So there is a set goal for the PCs, but they are pretty free in how they go about that goal. It could use a few more side quests, however.

 

[GregoryOatmeal]

Man...I'd really like a few of those APs in 5E format. Particularly Kingmaker. And some of those monsters and classes. I don't buy this "PF and 5E are apples and oranges" stuff at all. A good Pathfinder adventure translates just fine to 5E. You can run Forgotten Realms all day in Pathfinder and Golarion all day in 5E without any translation. Adventures take a bit more work balancing encounters and remaking monsters, but the systems are not worlds apart.

I think it's possible (remotely?) to see Paizo do 5E with a good OGL. A few points worth noting
- Paizo claims their profits are primarily based on selling accessory books - adventure paths, adventures, supplements, etc.
- WOTC claimed their profits are primarily based on selling core books. I think this is probably still true since they are publishing very little material outside the core books lately.
- Paizo is going to print themselves into a glut of materials and saturate their own market. Pathfinder GMs have enough material to game forever. This will hurt sales and cause Paizo to reevaluate their business.
- 5E will also hurt sales and cause Paizo to reevaluate their business. They are in very direct (albeit friendly) competition and 5E is the shiny new trendy product right now. People may still play Pathfinder (moreso...maybe...) but Pathfinder will generally be the product that everyone already purchased.

So in short, due to reinvigorated competition, market saturation, and a point of maturity in the product cycle, Pathfinder's best days of sales are behind us. Paizo will have a few options:
- Branch out further into card games, board games, minis, etc.
- Create a Pathfinder 2nd Edition. This could be very risky and alienating to a fan base that is sort of built around preserving a gaming tradition started by 3rd edition.
- Build 5E OGL products. Paizo could also benefit from the increased brand recognition they now have from years of Pathfinder.

Me - I love WOTC and love Paizo. I used to give a lot of money to Paizo, but that dried up with 5E. I would love for there to be more 5E materials and I would love to buy more Paizo products. I bought most of my Paizo stuff between 2010-2012. I think I was almost completely unaware of the company before then.

 

[aramis erak]

Right. Except for the no PDFs, no digital tools, no OGL, and no adventurer's league home play.

If I didn't know better, I'd say they're going out of their way to make their game a PITA to play. But yeah, great hands.

Home play of AL is allowed. For ToD, we have a 2-module AP, and you're allowed to get the additional modules from your FLGS and play them at home as part of AL. It's just that you have to report through the FLGS.

You might actually read what the requirements are before going off half-cocked.

The no PDFs and no OGL are not really that big an issue. The pirates have seen to it there are decent enough to use scans. I'd much rather drop $30 for a set of OEM PDFs, but since I've got over $100 worth of dead tree...

 

[Doctor Futurity]

I suspect that to get the best picture of why Paizo might or might not want to work in some sort of partnership with WotC again you would want to go back to the arrangement they had before when they were in partnership, doing the magazines and early adventure paths (when Pathfinder was a brand name for their D&D modules and not a game in its own right). That partnership dissolved rapidly and it was only through Eric, Lisa and others' cunning business acumen that they were able to turn it into a much better deal for Paizo as a result....plenty of other companies would have folded under similar circumstances, but Paizo thrived. For this reason alone I have a hard time imagining them seeking any new business partnership even though I would love it if they did.

 

[chriton227]

Home play of AL is allowed. For ToD, we have a 2-module AP, and you're allowed to get the additional modules from your FLGS and play them at home as part of AL. It's just that you have to report through the FLGS.

You might actually read what the requirements are before going off half-cocked.

The no PDFs and no OGL are not really that big an issue. The pirates have seen to it there are decent enough to use scans. I'd much rather drop $30 for a set of OEM PDFs, but since I've got over $100 worth of dead tree...

Actually only LMoP and ToD are eligible for Adventure's League home play. All of the Expeditions modules (all of the rest of the AL modules currently out) are not supposed to be available for home play, they are for public play only. Here is the announcement from the AL Community Manager.

If you are getting the modules intended for public play from the FLGS, playing them at home, and then getting the FLGS to lie on the reporting tool to report it as a fake public event both you and the FLGS are breaking the rules for AL play.

 

[Uchawi]

I am more interested in Paizo releasing Pathfinder 2.0, even if it something completely different than D&D.