painandgreed said:By the mere fact that they've been given the duty to save the world means that not only is it possible but almost assured to happen. I've never seen a D&D campaign end with "You die. She dies. Everybody dies." Now the players are not only facing something they might not find interesting, but also they don't have any challenge in it either.
DragonLancer said:I mentioned this thread to two of my players tonight (non-game situation), and both were a little shocked that they (as players) should be the driving force behind a game and/or campaign.
They agreed that they should have the right to decide what their characters do in such a world-shaking SL, but that if the DM has made that the basis of the campaign (whether the characters were made for it or not) it is their responsibility to play that SL and find ways to get involved.
AlecAustin said:I know you caveated your comments by not aiming them at anyone in particular, but I just wanted to say a few things with regards to your comments about campaigns not ending in mass PC death.
I, like many others here have been DMing for a long time, for me its been 14 years. I have learned one major fact. The DM creates the immersive world and everything in it, a sandbox if you will. But its the players story thats being told, not the DMs. Yes the DM has a story line that he/she creates that the players have options of going down or not going down.Being that I am with a group that has been in the same campaign for going on 5 years now with the same characters, and relatively the same players for the entire time I can add something that happened to my group.
After one of the 'adventures' that the group was on, we decided to get some down time to lick our wounds a little and rest in a city for a change. After spending a few days in the city we began hearing rumors about continued losses in caravan traffic between one country and another along a specific route. Now that was an obvious bait for us to say, "Hey, that sounds like the perfect job for us to do!" But for whatever reason we chose to ignore it. I think one of the mages had decided to spend this time to learn some new spells so that was a big factor in our down time.
Not having taken the bait along the rumor control route, a few members of the group were approached by a merchant who asked us to travel with them as guards, as he knew of us and the tasks that we had hired out for in the past. Still declined the bait and decided to stay. All the while relaxing and meeting people. Restocking supplies, and our resident 'rogue' began finding a way to setup a perminent fence shop. Legally of course.
Still when that bait was not taken the leader of our group, who was a royal son to a Duke, was approached by a courier who gave him a letter detailing him to travel to this frontier post to see why no updates had been heard of for over a month. This we took, not because it sounded more interesting, which it did, but because he was now charged by his oath to his family and the country to obey. Little did we know that this frontier post was on the path that the caravan routes were traveling through and being abducted.
So all in all, as long as you do not force it on your party, or at least not to seem like your forcing it on them and make it seem like their duty, interesting, or different they may or may not bite the hook.
Now the events that transpired because of this little Duty to Country, and oh hey look caravans are being abducted adventure hook ended up to be an end of the world type setting which has taken 3 years to maintain and get near the end. And because of events that transpired during these events in other parts of the world because of the actions of the players, parts of the nations changed. War, conquest, that sort of thing. All because we as players fail to see the BIG picture at times.
Sorry this little explanation turned into a rant/ disertation.
This depends on what sorts of stories your group is interested in. The Lord of the Rings, after all, was a story about some insignificant hobbits who managed to save the world. That sort of story might not flow from the default assumptions of D&D, but it's certainly possible to manage in a role-playing game. I've run a number of campaigns that featured PCs who managed—through cleverness, daring, and a bit of luck—to have an outsize impact on the game world.I also say these sorts of things are only for the highest level PCs. No 3rd level PC should be saving the world. He might save the village.
Point made. I probably would not run that sort of campaign. I'm the sort where if the world is at stake and the PCs fail then the world is done. I'm a let the dice fall where they fall kind of guy. So in general I almost never even at high level put the whole world on the line. The world goes down only after a long series of defeats at the hands of evil. It's more of a growing shadow than a sudden apocalypse.This depends on what sorts of stories your group is interested in. The Lord of the Rings, after all, was a story about some insignificant hobbits who managed to save the world. That sort of story might not flow from the default assumptions of D&D, but it's certainly possible to manage in a role-playing game. I've run a number of campaigns that featured PCs who managed—through cleverness, daring, and a bit of luck—to have an outsize impact on the game world.
Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Consequences are the DM s friend. As long as it's a doomsday that doesn't end the game.I am sure a lot of DMs have wanted to do world shattering events, the kind of events that change the world as the PCs know it, and often involves saving it. Now, what to do if your PCs just say "meh" and go on their way after hearing the dommsday omen from some mysterious figure. Would it be fair to have them adventure for normal for a while, then have the event occur because the PCs did nothing to stop it?