D&D 4E WotC and 4E Communication Feedback

[sjmiller]

Why? Why does it take more than being flat-out told that the DI will be optional, multiple times, for you to believe? Why does it take more than being told by one of the playtest DMs that the highest tech at his game table is a three-ring binder? I am all for being sceptic. I am all for calling Wizards on their mistakes, in a reasonable fashion. But I don't see how it would benefit WotC in any way to 1) be untruthful in this, or 2) even do what you suggest.

Why? Because nearly everything that is accessable from the Wizards main D&D page seems to show that DDI is an integral part of the "new D&D". Because Bill Slavicsek, in his Ampersand article says:

We also announced that for the first time, the D&D game would consist of four integral and integrated parts. In addition to the physical products—the core rulebooks, supplements, adventures, miniatures, and accessories—the D&D experience would be enhanced by robust Community features (powered by Gleemax.com), a fully integrated Organized Play program that will offer benefits to convention and home play alike, and the digital initiative we’re calling D&D Insider.

Plus you add the teaser video, the video of the GenCon presentation, and you can see where someone who does not want to be forced to buy into a "monthly service game" would be concerned.

 

[DonTadow]

Slow Clap Time

Ok, I heard about 4th edition Wednesday evening and it didn't settle with me what I was hearing. It felt like they were reinventing the wheel and it still felt like that until yesterday. But after reading every bit of factual news from 4e, I can say I"ve changed my mind. the information sounds good and outside of the internet component (which i'm scared will replace great tools like rptools and dmgenie) it sounds ok. I could see myself switching to 4e if many of the rumors are true.

 

[rjdafoe]

I have been lurking here for years, but never felt a desire to post until now. The 4th edition comments are very confusing to me.

Even though I won't be playing it, some others are happy and thats kewl..

This part confuses me. Why do you have all of these concerns, if you have made the decision to not play it? I get confused by all this negativity over the new edition without anyone actually having seen the actual product yet. It is happening in my group also. There are a couple of people that have said: "Not interested" just by asking them if they knew that 4th edition has been announced....

I just don't get it. Maybe it is just me, but I like to make a decision, after it comes out. Right now, if I were WotC, your comments have less weight, as it seems that you cannot be won over, as you have made your decision without any regards to what the product may actually be.

 

[Khairn]

That doesn't make sense to me. WotC will want to maximize its profits. If the DI is an add-on, they will receive income from all gamers interested in 4E, plus extra revenue from those gamers interested in and capable of utilizing what the DI has to offer. If the DI were mandatory, you cut away revenue from those people in the former group that aren't also in the latter group, and vice versa. Thus, a lower amount of money gained. It is in WotC's best interest to make the DI attractive, but optional.

First off, I never said that WotC would say that its necessary, I agree that they would cut their own throats if they did. What I am saying is that it makes dum-dum basic 101, business sense for WotC to create the DD in such a way that it is indispensible. If you do not understand or believe that I'm not certain the rest of my reasoning will make any sense.

Taken from a purely financial & business point of view, $10 a month for a year is worth more than 5x $30 books bought unevenly throughout the year, because of the financial stability it would provide. My actual ratio above may be off but the principle is valid.

So what we have is a business situation where its in WotC's best interest to make the DDI absolutely necessary, versus a customer relations situation where they have to appear to to make the DDI an unnecessary "extra".

Why? Why does it take more than being flat-out told that the DI will be optional, multiple times, for you to believe? Why does it take more than being told by one of the playtest DMs that the highest tech at his game table is a three-ring binder? I am all for being sceptic. I am all for calling Wizards on their mistakes, in a reasonable fashion. But I don't see how it would benefit WotC in any way to 1) be untruthful in this, or 2) even do what you suggest.

Of course 4E and the DI are developed together. Otherwise, how could there be a functional character generator? Or an e-code to activate book contents in that generator? But the level of DI-necessity you seem to think will be good for WotC profits strikes me as a serious hit for WotC profits.

It takes more than the being told "the DDI will never be necessary" because that statement doesn't make sense (to me) and goes against the financial benefits of the monthly subscription business model that WotC is now adopting.

Again, this is only my opinion, and you may fully believe that WotC will never make plans to make the DDI a necessary part of 4E. But as I said in my response to Mike above ...

when the magazines were cancelled, we were told that there was a reason for it, and that the DI was coming and that we would be blown away by what we saw.

When Gleemax's "placeholder" was launched we were told that it was part of the DI and that we would be wowed when we saw everything you had in store for us

For months and months and months we were given snippets of info, provided with glimpses of potential functionality and told that we should be excited about what's coming.

Then you announce 4E, and state that it and the DDI (new name for the DI) are being woven and developed together to promote and support each other. You bring out all the many functions of the DDI and tout it as a new beginning for the game and the gaming community.

And after all that you now want to tell us that the DDI is NOT really linked to 4E, that its separate and not the story, that its all about the game. You want us to believe that the logical benefits of making the DDI a necessity, rather than just a neat and unnecessary add-on, have never entered WotC's (or Hasbro's) mind and have no impact on how the game is being developed?

For me the claims of 4E and DDI seperation are an illusion, and I made my saving throw.

But hey ... its just my crystal ball.

 

[Korgoth]

I just don't get it. Maybe it is just me, but I like to make a decision, after it comes out.

You make decisions based on facts? What are you, some kind of Communist?

 

[Ry]

You make decisions based on facts? What are you, some kind of Communist?

Get him! He might be a Canadian!

 

[rjdafoe]

You make decisions based on facts? What are you, some kind of Communist?

LOL, yes, I guess I would be then.....

Anyways, I am all for constructive critism of what is going on with 4th edition. But announcing you have no intention of playing it without some sort of look at what the rules are, is a little off in my book.

You can like some of the features, and have concern for some of the other features. That is all fine and good. this whole DI think has everyone up in arms and I am not sure why.

Yes, there is a possibility that eventually the DI may be required. But there is also the possibilty that they will scrap 4th edition, if you want to talk possibilities. The 3.0 PH came with a character generator! I did not see that become needed at the game tables (leaving out the whole fiasco).

Why can't the DI exist to enhance peoples games an not others? Unless I see in the PH under the CLASSES heading a list of all the classes with a URL next to it, the DI will be optional to me.

 

[Dinkeldog]

Let's bring the conversation back on topic, please.

--Dinkeldog/Moderator

 

[(contact)]

You mean on the UNFINISHED story hour thread?

Yes. Yes I do.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

If any of you folks have suggestions on how we can do a better job of making that clear to people, I'd greatly value your insight on this.

Yeah. Or rather, I'd like to know a lot more about what you get for the money you pay for the electronic parts.

Correct me if I'm getting anything wrong:

So there's three ways to use the DI: Just get an account, get a subscription, and use (and pay for) activation codes found in books.

What I'd like to know is what we'll get if we just get an account: Will we get the same stuff we used to get before? Errata, previews, art galleries, web enhancements, the occasional article about all matter of stuff, some simple lists for feats and stuff and so on. Will we get less, as things move to the non-free part? Will we get more, as some previews of new stuff from the payable area will leak over?

I'd also like to know what we'll get for the activation codes. Especially whether I need to subscribe in order to use them, or if subscribing in addition to unlocking will give me any benefit or discount. And generally, what will I get when I use the code? There's supposed to be an electronic version of the books. What form will it take? PDF? Something else? Will it be protected? If so, how?

Finally, what will the subscription give me?