D&D 4E WotC and 4E Communication Feedback

[Khairn]

Thanks for the feedback on this. It's important that people know this isn't the case, so I'm going to mull it over and see if I can put it into the right perspective.

Off the top of my head, I'd say that different parts of the digital tools are really aimed at specific groups of people:

- Those who don't play D&D anymore because their game groups are spread out.
- People who are looking to find new members for their group, or new groups entirely.
- DMs who struggle with the amount of time it takes for them to prepare their campaigns.
- Anyone who enjoys the convenience of being able to build, view, and print their characters on the computer.
- People who enjoy having electronic versions of their paper products.

I think most people will find some aspect of the suite of digital tools to be helpful for them. On the other hand, everyone will be able to benefit for all the changes and improvements going into 4E. D&D 4th Edition is the real story here, and the digital tools and other D&Di content is receiving more then it's fair of the hype. I think in today's age, visually flashy stuff tends to get the most play with the media and with online communities, because it's easier to grab most people's attention.

But the bottom line is that the real story is 4th Edition. Yes, we have lots of cool and neat tools to help people who are interested in those sorts of things, but this is about the evolution of D&D, the paper product you play when sitting around the table with your friends.

If any of you folks have suggestions on how we can do a better job of making that clear to people, I'd greatly value your insight on this.

-Mike

Mike,

when the magazines were cancelled, we were told that there was a reason for it, and that the DI was coming and that we would be blown away by what we saw.

When Gleemax's "placeholder" was launched we were told that it was part of the DI and that we would be wowed when we saw everything you had in store for us

For months and months and months we were given snippets of info, provided with glimpses of potential functionality and told that we should be excited about what's coming.

Then you announce 4E, and state that it and the DDI (new name for the DI) are being woven and developed together to promote and support each other. You bring out all the many functions of the DDI and tout it as a new beginning for the game and the gaming community.

And after all that you now want to tell us that the DDI is NOT really linked to 4E, that its separate and not the story, that its all about the game. You want us to believe that the logical benefits of making the DDI a necessity, rather than just a neat and unnecessary add-on, have never entered WotC's (or Hasbro's) mind and have no impact on how the game is being developed?

Sorry Mike, but it will take more than the explanation you provided above to convince me, and I believe a number of others, of that story.





Please understand I have no problem with the DDI itself and can see lots of potential with it. I also have no problem with launching 4E. Even though I won't be playing it, some others are happy and thats kewl. I do however have a problem with many of the decisions that were made such as the cancellation of the magazines, dropping Grayhawk, focusing support for only those with computers and internet, and the overall online / MMORPG direction that I see in the wording of the announcements, the flavor of some of the new rules and the very expensive hobby you are creating.

As a D&D GM for many years, I used to laugh at MMORPG and Games Workshop players for the amount of money they spent every year, just to stay current with their chosen hobby. The cost of staying current with D&D now blows them out of the water.

Just a few personal perceptions.

 

[mhacdebhandia]

If this is true then I wonder this...if the expanded content is valuable enough to charge for...will it make an apreciable difference in gameplay between those with and those without? if not, why charge for it?

I think it was Scott Rouse who stated that the main reasons they're planning to charge a fee are a) to recoup the cost of producing the e-material rather than simply add it to the price of the book (because not everyone will care about the e-material), and b) so that they get something from the people who will simply write down the codes from the book in a store or from their friend's copy (this also means that if you buy the copy someone's copied the codes from, you won't be screwed out of the e-material).

The latter suggests to me that you won't be able to activate the e-material for a book without a D&D Insider subscription, because I doubt that Wizards of the Coast will make a full electronic copy of the book plus supporting material available for a "cup of coffee" price - so even those who simply steal the codes will still be paying their $10 per month.

 

[Mokona]

If you have any ideas

#1 top priority idea:

Spoil anything and everything as soon as possible. Let us know all the dirty secrets and then have huge numbers of gamers playtesting and reporting back. Except for the nutter-fringe everyone will buy a great game and 4th edition is more likely to be the best it can be using my method.

The standard marketing approach at Wizards of the Coast is to slowly (very very slowly) leak out a tiny bit of information at a time. That works for expansions but isn't so good with a total overhaul. Overwhelm us with information about Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition and we'll fall in love with it as R&D has done.

 

[Glyfair]

The standard marketing approach at Wizards of the Coast is to slowly (very very slowly) leak out a tiny bit of information at a time. That works for expansions but isn't so good with a total overhaul. Overwhelm us with information about Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition and we'll fall in love with it as R&D has done.

You do really realize that the reason this sties exists and is so popular is because WotC leaked out bits of information over time? I disagree with your theory.

 

[Tharen the Damned]

I hope not! Probably on the boards a while back, or on one of my Story Hour threads.

You mean on the UNFINISHED story hour thread?

 

[mhacdebhandia]

If nothing else, it is very clear that a large part of the reason why Wizards of the Coast haven't been more forthcoming about Fourth Edition is because it hasn't been finished yet.

Listen to the podcast, or read Dave Noonan's playtest report. They had only eight character classes available to test in Dave's game, and they're not even fixed in their current form!

It seems obvious that they know the broad strokes - party roles, sources of power, 30 levels, per-day/per-encounter/at-will abilities - but not the concrete details.

If they showed you everything they have now, you'd simply get the wrong idea about what will be in the books come May 2008.

 

[Ashardalon]

Its in WotC's best interests to make the DDi as necessary as possible.

That doesn't make sense to me. WotC will want to maximize its profits. If the DI is an add-on, they will receive income from all gamers interested in 4E, plus extra revenue from those gamers interested in and capable of utilizing what the DI has to offer. If the DI were mandatory, you cut away revenue from those people in the former group that aren't also in the latter group, and vice versa. Thus, a lower amount of money gained. It is in WotC's best interest to make the DI attractive, but optional.

Sorry Mike, but it will take more than the explanation you provided above to convince me, and I believe a number of others, of that story.

Why? Why does it take more than being flat-out told that the DI will be optional, multiple times, for you to believe? Why does it take more than being told by one of the playtest DMs that the highest tech at his game table is a three-ring binder? I am all for being sceptic. I am all for calling Wizards on their mistakes, in a reasonable fashion. But I don't see how it would benefit WotC in any way to 1) be untruthful in this, or 2) even do what you suggest.

Of course 4E and the DI are developed together. Otherwise, how could there be a functional character generator? Or an e-code to activate book contents in that generator? But the level of DI-necessity you seem to think will be good for WotC profits strikes me as a serious hit for WotC profits.

 

[JoelF]

Mike,

I have two big concerns about DDI. First of all, it's all bundled together from what I can glean from the various posts, Gen Con announcements, etc. What if I want the DM Tool suites (mapping tool, digital minis through the maps, and character gen tools) but don't really care for the Dungeon and Dragon on line content? (Say, maybe because I think Paizo does a better job with Pathfinder than WOTC does with the new Dungeon and Dragon content.) I strongly urge that there be a separate and reasonably lower fee for the tool and the magazine content, or a discounted combined subscription. That way, if one or the other proves way more popular with the fan base, it can thrive on its own merits, without the lack of enthusiam for the other dragging down the overall subscription numbers.

My second concern is: why make the tool suit subscription based at all? I much prefer the model which Code Monkey used. Buy your data set, and then it's yours, you own it, and can use it forever. Under the subscription model, I have to pay a monthly fee forever to use a tool which in reality I may use a lot less some times than others, and is simply a piece of software. I know that there's talk of a pay as you go plan, paying per session, but that doesn't sound economical unless someone's just sampling the tools for the first time. Can't there be a way to pay some fee ($40-50, similar to a computer or console game) for the tools, and then pay to activate the new content from new books, and not have a monthly fee set up? Also, what happens if you subscribe for a year, then decide it's too expensive? You have nothing. If you buy the software outright, you own it and can use it forever. Sure WOTC will make more money per subscriber with a subscription model, but how many less users will there be compared to a purchase model?

 

[Merkuri]

I have a suggestion on how to better communicate with the fans:

Make an official 4E FAQ page and link to it on the D&D homepage. Put the link smack dab in the middle and make it impossible to miss. Put questions in it you see people complaining about on these forums and things that get misinterpreted easily (like "will I need a computer to play 4E?" and "will there be OGL in 4E?").

Basically, recreate this thread in an official manner. Make it something people can point to for proof in arguments. When new questions start popping up, add them to the FAQ. If a question keeps popping up yet that you can't answer (like, "what classes/races will be in 4E?") add the question anyway and put "we can't answer this yet" (or something similar) in the answer.

Don't rely on us to compile our own lists of information. I think an official FAQ will help stop some rumors and bad feelings now.

 

[Ry]

I second Merkuri's suggestion, although I stand by my earlier statement about branding and mixed messages.