D&D (2024) WoTc and TSR... what is D&D

[GMforPowergamers]

in another thread we were talking about cantrips. One poster said 'prior to 3e' that wasn't true... but yeah that was 23 years ago now that anything was published by tsr for before 3e.

so I got to thinking. in 2024 we have the 50 anniversary and something is coming (is it a redone 5e, is it 5.5 is it 6e, will it just be called D&D anniversary edition? who knows) but come that day in mid august when we all come here to complain or praise or what ever this new product... it will be WotC has owned D&D as long or longer than TSR.

in another thread I was told that the half way through a edition is "in the end game of" and the two things together kinda hit my head.

so 3e, 4e, and 5e have held out as long as basic, 1e and 2e. realistically the d20 system (3e) was the BIGGEST of the changes and has stuck (I don't see THan0 and non weapons profs rolling below stats coming back anytime soon.)

so as we look to 2024 (and in theory into 2034 for the 60th) do 1e or 2e really hold much sway anymore?

I have made no bones and hid nothing, 4e was my favorite edition... but 2e and 5e are both neck and neck for second (and 2e got a big head start from rose tinted nostalgia) however we are now looking at player bases that joined in 5e, they never knew Thac0, they never knew a time when Cantrip was a spell you had to prep in a 1st level slot, and they never heard of Save Vs rod staff or wand... but most also don't remember that feats were NEW to many of us old timers. that HP used to be WAY lower...

then I thought about the people who never knew what a prestige class was... people that never saw a fighter use "come and get it" and they are still D&D fans playing right now. Going forward a VERY high amount of players and DMs never bought a TSR product... and the longer time goes on the bigger that % becomes.

what does this mean for the game I started in 94/95? I don't know. It just is something in my head so now I am forcing you to all think aboout it.

 

[BookTenTiger]

One thing I enjoy about D&D is that it's a very personal hobby. No matter who is publishing it, what editions are being published, etc etc, two tables playing D&D might be using different rules, playing vastly different games... and yet both are playing D&D!

So one person's D&D might be rooted in AD&D, another may be entirely 5e, another may have 4e as their strongest interest... And they are all D&D!

 

[Kurotowa]

Welcome to getting old. I'm 43 and I've run into that feeling more than once, in a lot of different situations. If you don't want to become the old man who yells at clouds, practice accepting that other people have vastly different life experiences and that's okay. Goodness knows it's a hard skill to master, but after all the times my parents and grandparents failed to understand the world I grew up in it's one I try my best to practice.

 

[Retreater]

As much as it pains me to say it, nothing in D&D prior to 2014 has much significance on most current players.
If we look at it like console generations for video games, these are my analogies.

D&D 5e = PS4/Xbox One era (been out forever, feeling clunky and long-in-the-tooth, but no one has really had a good reason or ability to upgrade)
D&D 4e = Sega Dreamcast (the system fans love it, most people have never played it, and it crashed quickly)
3.x = PS2 (the basis of modern game design, but clunky, slow, and you probably don't want to go back to it. also your first DVD player/d20 game)
AD&D = NES (primitive, good for old timer nostalgia. you recognize some of the characters from this era, but if you're a modern player you don't want to play these games)
OD&D/Basic = Pong console (it can do one game, the controls are weird, graphic are primitive. some people can still play for hours and enjoy it, but has little appeal to modern audiences. still, if you look closely enough, you can see the origins.)

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Welcome to getting old.

yup

I'm 43

I turn 42 this year

and I've run into that feeling more than once, in a lot of different situations. If you don't want to become the old man who yells at clouds, practice accepting that other people have vastly different life experiences and that's okay. Goodness knows it's a hard skill to master, but after all the times my parents and grandparents failed to understand the world I grew up in it's one I try my best to practice.

i try,,, but also "Get them off my lawn"


"I was with it once... but I didn't change, it did. Now What I am isn't it, and what it is I'm not. Now new things seem strange and weird to me... and it will happen to you TOO..."

 

[GMforPowergamers]

D&D 4e = Sega Dreamcast (the system fans love it, most people have never played it, and it crashed quickly)

post 4... is that a record for someone to come in and bash 4e?

 

[Maxperson]

in another thread we were talking about cantrips. One poster said 'prior to 3e' that wasn't true... but yeah that was 23 years ago now that anything was published by tsr for before 3e.

so I got to thinking. in 2024 we have the 50 anniversary and something is coming (is it a redone 5e, is it 5.5 is it 6e, will it just be called D&D anniversary edition? who knows) but come that day in mid august when we all come here to complain or praise or what ever this new product... it will be WotC has owned D&D as long or longer than TSR.

in another thread I was told that the half way through a edition is "in the end game of" and the two things together kinda hit my head.

so 3e, 4e, and 5e have held out as long as basic, 1e and 2e. realistically the d20 system (3e) was the BIGGEST of the changes and has stuck (I don't see THan0 and non weapons profs rolling below stats coming back anytime soon.)

so as we look to 2024 (and in theory into 2034 for the 60th) do 1e or 2e really hold much sway anymore?

To me they are like the bedrock foundation that D&D is built on. Because of them, armor class, hit points, alignment, races, classes, levels, experience points=, etc. are still in the game, even though most have gone through changes over the years. The core set of ideas that began when D&D was created has endured.

That also means that we can look back at those ideas to gain some understanding of blank spots in recent editions. 5e reduced alignment to one vague sentence that is nearly useless as an RP aid, but we can look back at all prior editions for ideas on how we want to implement a particular alignment for monsters(as DM) and for our PCs(as players). We can look back at how hit points were handled in prior editions if we don't like how the current one handles them or to fill in blanks.

I have made no bones and hid nothing, 4e was my favorite edition... but 2e and 5e are both neck and neck for second (and 2e got a big head start from rose tinted nostalgia) however we are now looking at player bases that joined in 5e, they never knew Thac0, they never knew a time when Cantrip was a spell you had to prep in a 1st level slot, and they never heard of Save Vs rod staff or wand... but most also don't remember that feats were NEW to many of us old timers. that HP used to be WAY lower...

For me 3e is far and away my favorite, just because I had so many classes, races, prestige classes, feats, spells, etc. that I could build virtually any concept I could imagine, perfectly or nearly so. 2e and 5e are tied for 2nd for me as well, though.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Every edition is D&D that was called D&D officially, from OD&D to 5e. The most recent edition is the only one that really matters at any given moment.

"Back in my day we didn't have cantrips" is about as effective as telling someone now "back in my day, we only had an AM radio in the car." Both probably won't matter all that much to the person now.

 

[Maxperson]

I turn 42 this year

I turned 52 last month. Love being born on that even decade. Makes the age math very easy to figure out.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Every edition is D&D that was called D&D officially, from OD&D to 5e. The most recent edition is the only one that really matters at any given moment.

"Back in my day we didn't have cantrips" is about as effective as telling someone now "back in my day, we only had an AM radio in the car." Both probably won't matter all that much to the person now.

I'm sorry to laugh... but my grandfather use to complain about FM radio ruining long range radio