Can you not comprehend that I've been quoting and directing you to the 5e DMG. If you don't like, bring it up to WotC, not me.
I can comprehend that when you say you are quoting, you are quoting.
Can you comprehend that if you defend a position, people will argue with you over your defense? Generally with the expectation that you won't turn around and accuse them of being incapable of reading comprehension.
Um. No. That section is on all of the cosmologies having that list of planes unless the DM says otherwise. You should read it some time.
It says "These are the planes." and "These are the various ways that people have described the jumble of planes." Then it goes on to list all of the various cosmologies. Nothing I quoted was Great Wheel specific.
And you "demonstrated" it by declaring that what is written in the DMG isn't true. You don't get to declare that. You can opt out of it for your game, but you can't say that it isn't written that way.
Here it is....................again.
"Sages have constructed a few such theoretical models to make sense of the jumble of planes, particularly the Outer Planes. The three most common are the Great Wheel, the World Tree, and the World Axis, but you can create or adapt whatever model works best for the planes you want to use in your game."
The models(plural) include the world axis and all of the planes listed. But YOU can create or ADAPT whatever model works best for the planes YOU want to use in YOUR game.
Use the World Axis and take out the positive and negative energy planes.
You seriously can never respond to me without insulting me, can you?
I have read it. I read when you quoted it. If I didn't read it, I wouldn't have noticed that it said "No being in the multiverse can look down and see the planes in their arrangement the same way as we look at a diagram in a book. No mortal can verify whether Mount Celestia is sandwiched between Bytopia and Arcadia, but it's a convenient theoretical construct based on the philosophical shading among the three planes and the relative importance they give to law and good." You know, that part you bolded? That part that was only about how the Great Wheel isn't literally a wheel?
And then it goes on to list MULTIPLE PLANES that are specific to the Great Wheel. In fact, as I have shown, Bytopia is Great Wheel specific, so you even quoted something Great Wheel specific. This is not a difficult thing here. Because the World Axis isn't just that the planes aren't arranged in a wheel, the World Axis has different planes of existence entirely. And sure, it says that scholars have arranged things to show the World Axis instead of the Great Wheel, but the biggest and single most iconic change for that cosmology is the Elemental Chaos.
Would you like to read what the DMG says about the Elemental Chaos? You always accuse me of not reading things, so here ya go.
"
At the farthest extents of the Elemental Planes, the pure elements dissolve and bleed together into an unending tumult of clashing energies and colliding substance called the Elemental Chaos. Elementals can be found here as well, but they usually don’t stay long, preferring the comfort of their native planes. Reports indicate the existence of weird hybrid elementals native to the Elemental Chaos, but such creatures are seldom seen on other planes."
That's it. That is the ENTIRE entry on the Elemental Chaos, and, do you notice some... of things? I mean, you read, so you must right? Like the fact that the Elemental Chaos is located at the farthest ends of the Elemental Planes. Not that it is an alternative to them, that it only exists as part of them. Also, it says that elementals exist here, but they prefer their native planes. What do you think the native planes of the Elementals in the World Axis cosmology is? Do you think it is the Astral Sea? The Prime Material? Because this makes it clear that they AREN'T native to the Elemental Chaos.
So, that was from the World Axis, would you like me to post everything on the Elemental Planes of the Great Wheel? Well, I'm not posting it because it is 5 PAGES of material, including sub-locations within them.
So how about you stop acting like the Great Wheel isn't being given preferential treatment here.
You don't get to change what he was talking about into your pet meaning.
You don't get to declare that I'm wrong about what he said. It isn't like you have any greater insight into HIS intente than I do.
There was no "gotcha" man. You declared that only two types of violence were okay and I just asked if those were the only two allowed.
This isn't what I said. I've explained what I said, so even if you didn't understand it the first time, I clarified. So how are you getting it wrong twice?
