WotC Responds!!!
- Thread starter BlackWych
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Gothmog said:
I just had to pick on that a little bit. Addictions come in all forms. Some people are in fact addicted to pornography. Some people are addicted to sex. For better or for worse this book is related to one or the other of these (and or both or neither depending on your tastes, I'm eliminating the moral imperative here) and they can and do cause health problems. Am I saying the Book of Erotic Fantasy will be the ruination of d20, D&D or Role Playing games? Not hardly. I don't give it near that much credit. Am I saying the BoEF will soil young minds and lead to little Billy growing up, having unsafe or violent sex and hurting himself or someone else? Nope. But I am not dismissing that it could. Addiction in most any form is generally not a good thing. Even being addicted to say, reading the Bible could be a very bad thing. Addiction itself is bad because it implies a dependence upon something in order to "function". That's all.
Bendris Noulg
First Post
Essentially, all forms of addiction are of two forms: Mental and Physical.Harlock said:
Mental addiction is related to some emotional lacking, void, misunderstanding, or other such related instance. In this, I'm sure most will agree that D&D and just about anything else can become an addict's "hook".
Physical addiction is what cigarettes are most often perscribed to. The nicotene causes a shift in body chemistry in which the body slowly becomes more and more used to it being there, using it instead of other chemicals to perform certain functions.
So when it's said that D&D isn't addictive, what is meant is that D&D doesn't cause physical addiction in the same manner as smoking. Nor, in fact, does it cause mental addiction, since that is indeed caused by something else and D&D simply becomes the "focus" of neurotic behavior.
Nyarlathotep
Explorer
The Sigil said:3.) There is contained within the thread a perfect example of what I mean when I talk about "ramming your ideology down my throat" - albeit a subtle one.
The "unashamed" says to me, "THIS IS WHAT I THINK AND YOU HAVE TO BE OKAY WITH IT." Just drop the "unashamed," please (maybe I'm reading too much into it). Obviously, you're unashamed - you cam out and told us you're doing the project! Mentioning it in a sig is just trying to rub our noses in it if we disagree.
I love reading your posts Sigil (even though I never seem to agree with them), but this made me chuckle a little.
Here is what your sig says:
Once (it abadons the notion of absolute morality for that of relative morality), a society loses its capacity to distinguish between right and wrong and the will to declare that some things are wrong per se. Without the lamp (of absolute morality), our world finds itself desperately building temporary defenses, drawing new lines, forever falling back, unwilling to confront. A society which permits anything will eventually lose everything!
--Quote adapted from Neal A. Maxwell
Pot - Kettle?
(I don't know, maybe it's too subtle and I'm reading too much into it too)
hehe, keep up the good work, I appreciate anyone who can so articulately argue their viewpoints. If every other forum I read had such well argued points I would be a total shut-in.
Gothmog
First Post
Originally posted by Harlock:
Good point Harlock. I was simply stating that this book will not be directly physically or psychologically addictive, unlike nicotine. I seriously doubt that this book will cause an addition to porn or sex due to reading/looking at it. Sexual addictions usually occur in people who engage in certain specific sexual activities/lifestyles anyway. Evidence is also increasingly pointing towards psychological addictions being the result of something called "addictive personality type", in which the person, for biochemical and possibly developmental reasons, is predisposed towards addictive behaviors. Anything done to excess can lead to problems down the road.
Good point Harlock. I was simply stating that this book will not be directly physically or psychologically addictive, unlike nicotine. I seriously doubt that this book will cause an addition to porn or sex due to reading/looking at it. Sexual addictions usually occur in people who engage in certain specific sexual activities/lifestyles anyway. Evidence is also increasingly pointing towards psychological addictions being the result of something called "addictive personality type", in which the person, for biochemical and possibly developmental reasons, is predisposed towards addictive behaviors. Anything done to excess can lead to problems down the road.
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Nyarlathotep
Explorer
Bendris Noulg said:
You sir, are my new ENWorld hero.
Bendris Noulg
First Post
What..?! I've got a fan...Nyarlathotep said:You sir, are my new ENWorld hero.
...
Eek! I'm shy...
Seriously, I'm kind of one of the pariahs around here... Don't like core balance... Dispise power gaming... Rewrote the Player's Handbook... Really, this is only going to get you in trouble...
Ehr... And when did I post that? (Edit: Nevermind... I get it now... Thanks.)
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Bendris Noulg
First Post
Got two "actually"s here...fusangite said:
First, what you actually posted was...
When you produce a product for an existing market or discourse community especially one of which children are a significant component, you do have some responsibilities.
Second, you weren't the only person to make the implication, so I simply used wording to cover the entire issue.
I'm saying that, as a mature product, it should gain the same consideration as the BoVD does. Also, looking at some of the shops I purchase gaiming supplies at, it should also receive the same consideration as Heavy Metal, Druuna, Cherry Blossom, Royo/Franzetta/Vellajo collections, and all the other "mature" material they carry. As such treatment is indeed the standard within the industry already, I find it hard to take seriously claims that this single book will be treated otherwise simply because it's part of the RPG section.
Speculation. Nothing thus far indicates that this will be a d20 product. In fact, everything thus far points only to the OGL, which isn't printed on either of the covers but on the inside.
Thing is, "sex games" are (based on those which I've owned, played and seen) require the person to physically do something with their partner (or a partner with a house rule or two). This isn't that at all, but is an RPG, with the same declare action/roll die/resolve mechanic, relating all events to the characters, just like any other RPG available.
If anything, this will simply add to the game as an option the following:
- Sex Magic (which I'm likely to review first with hopes of using)
- Rules for seduction (which I might use if it's well written)
- Rules for love (+2 Attack Bonus when defending your betrothed? Might use that...)
- Rules for sex itself (less likely to use, but will review anyways)
- Herbal/magical birth control (likely use if it's not cheesy/needlessly gross)
- STDs (nothing like a plague to stir up the heat in a campaign)
- Recognition that the chainmail bikini/loinclothe is a viable option (being as the Core Rules already allow it but no one talks about it)
Please stop trying to make this book look unreasonable by comparing it to things which do not bear comparison.
Bendris Noulg
First Post
AAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!Gothmog said:Yep, I have read your posts for a while too, and we think similarly on a lot of issues and topics. You'd be welcome to belly-up to my game table any time.
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