WotC setting search winner - Eberron

[Pants]

I don't see why people are getting hung up on the 'unique cultures' comment. They way I interpreted was that the staple races of D&D would have a unique twist to them. Maybe Dwarves are no longer xenophobic mountain dwellers with Scottish accents and a penchant for ale. Maybe they're something else.
My point is that passing off our statements and interpretations as fact when we haven't even seen the end result is foolish. Claiming that 'they lied about the setting' when we know so very little about it is foolish. Especially when the very people who are making this book have proven some of our hypothesis false. Personally, I am going to take the creator's word on this over someone's interpretation of a blurry promo picture.
You don't like the way the setting sounds or maybe the basic premise of it doesn't appeal to you? Fine, I can't make you like it. Me? I am just going to wait and see.

 

[MeepoTheMighty]

Never in my life have I found agreed so fully with pants.

Just look at my police record!

 

[drnuncheon]

You don' t think that hover trains count as higher than mediaeval tech then?

I guess that depends on how they work, doesn't it? Is a flying carpet 'higher than medieval tech'? How about a flying galleon? If those are OK, then why not a flying wagon, or several flying wagons hooked together? If those are not OK, why not?

There are also the skyscrapers

Salisbury Cathedral has a spire 404 feet tall - about 40 stories. The spire was finished in 1320. Medieval enough for ya?

and it has been described in places as industrial,

"a magically industrial edge" is what I see. One could describe Spelljammer as being "magical space exploration", but it was hardly high-tech.

Of course, that's also from a report that said "Strong presence of lost-world creatures such as dinosaurs", which we have since learned is inaccurate, so you need to take it with a grain of salt - if you're not looking for reasons to trash the setting, that is.

but the very fact that there are hover trains in the setting tends to suggest something that is not mediaeval, don't you think?

It may evoke a later-than-medieval image in people's heads. But that doesn't mean that there is later than medieval technology, does there?

J

 

[rounser]

If those are OK, then why not a flying wagon, or several flying wagons hooked together? If those are not OK, why not?

Flying carpets, ships and chariots, even an entire flying hunt all have mythological basis, and therefore fit very easily in people's conceptions of what is especially "correct" to be enchanted to fly in swords and sorcery fantasy. A flying wagon perhaps less so, but a wagon belongs in a medieval type setting too. A train doesn't....at least, not without some convincing context to convince the readers' suspension of disbelief otherwise.

The issue, then, is not that it's a magical hovering train; simply the fact that it appears to be a train. As I mentioned earlier, a magic train strikes me as cheesier than a mechanical one. If you must have a train in a swords & sorcery fantasy setting, make it the real McCoy, IMO. I believe there was a Dungeon Magazine adventure some time ago which had a prototype dwarven train in it. I could buy that, because dwarves are tinkerers, and it's conceivable that their culture could go industrial in some corner of the world - but not mainstream.

 

[EricNoah]

Behold the power of spite!

Not to pick on one poster, but yeesh, this really sums up much of this thread.

I'd like folks to please ease up on the accusatory tone, blanket generalizations, conspiracy theories, random cries of "you're a troll!" and so forth. If you can, great, this thread can live.

 

[coyote6]

I could buy that, because dwarves are tinkerers, and it's conceivable that their culture could go industrial in some corner of the world

Which dwarves? What dwarven culture are tinkerers? Are the dwarves of Eberron like that?

 

[rounser]

Which dwarves? What dwarven culture are tinkerers?

Under the stereotypical Tolkienesque view of dwarvish culture, they forge armour, they mine, they like to toil over forges - that's their thing, apart from hoarding precious metals - so arguably they have industrial overtones already. Gnomes subverted the inventor/tinker role thanks to Dragonlance, an idea that was later assimilated to FR, but it's easy to envision dwarves going proto-industrial in the cracks of a D&D world, perhaps harnessing steam power and gunpowder to a limited extent. Note that this is different from sending such stuff mainstream (more than a prototype train or two hidden away underground wouldn't be much to my liking, and as such was the limit of such technology in that Dungeon adventure), and making it a standard form of travel.

While on the topic, I think I'd associate gnome technology more with clockwork-style mechanics, Rube Goldberg devices, da Vinci inventions and hydraulics, and dwarven technology with steam power and gunpowder technology. Dwarven steampowered war-juggernauts, arquebuses and powder grenades seem "right", somehow. A gnome would probably invent the printing press, whereas a dwarf would probably invent the steamroller and proto-submarine.

 

[NickTheLemming]

Hey Nick,
You can start at Goodman Games' preview at http://www.goodman-games.com/4100preview.php ;
this is a unique setting that brings out the best that the game offers- I've seen hundreds of 'settings' and only a handful have ever caught my attention as really different!

Cool! Thanks for letting me know. I'll have a good look later and see what I think. I'm always in the market for a decent setting to plunder.

Nick the Lemming

 

[NickTheLemming]

I don't see why people are getting hung up on the 'unique cultures' comment. They way I interpreted was that the staple races of D&D would have a unique twist to them. Maybe Dwarves are no longer xenophobic mountain dwellers with Scottish accents and a penchant for ale. Maybe they're something else.

I have to say that this aspect is one that really pisses me off - the settings all had to include the usual races, in which case none of them are likely to be that original, or they have to go through the tack of being completely unrelated to the usual fantasy Dwarf, Elf etc stereotype, in which case they get picked on for doing weird things (What do you mean, Dwarves are more at home on the oceans than anywhere else and hate being underground?), with absolutely nothing in common with the stereotypes, which will only piss people off. Wouldn't it have been a much better idea just to have new races than have to use either the name or the current stereotype (Eg, the above might be called Dwarves in this setting, which will upset people because they're obviously un-Dwarflike - a much better solution would just be to call them something else if they're that different to the norm).

Nick the Lemming

 

[Goobermunch]

You don' t think that hover trains count as higher than mediaeval tech then? There are also the skyscrapers and it has been described in places as industrial, but the very fact that there are hover trains in the setting tends to suggest something that is not mediaeval, don't you think? Could you please tell me how my argument is worthless? I'd also look up the definition of reductio ad absurdum if I were you, since you don't seem to understand it.



Well, forgive me for being blunt, but it's you that appears to have the fixation on Harn...

Nick the Lemming

Nick,

Technology is not a thing in itself. It is a means to an end. By its nature it implies the application of science to an end. Technology and magic can accomplish the same ends via different means.

I can go to the store, buy a mag-lite and some batteries and have a portable lightsource.

My character can cast light on the end of his staff and have a portable lightsource.

The ends are the same. It's the means that matter.

[OT]And I do want to apologize about the troll comment. I honestly believed that you were being tongue-in-cheek and poking fun at people.[/OT]

--G