WotC Site Post 4E Release

[Scribble]

Yeah, they sure did. That's why the promised digital and integral part of 4th ed was ready at launch.... oh wait, no it wasn't. Or did you mean they learned their lesson about trying to do software development in house? No, they still didn't outsource this one either. Hmm.. I guess they didn't learn a thing from their mistakes.

Haven't seen it yet, so I have no idea.

Maybe they learned not to put out a product until it's ready?

The point is this was promised content that they KNEW wouldn't be ready at launch, but they didn't bother to go out of their way to let people know wasn't ready, and wouldn't be for months.

Yeah they have lousy ways of communicating. No argument there.

Letting us be their beta-testers isn't a substitute for missed deadlines and lack of content and communication.

Uhh?

If they want me to pay for it, then they have to put out a quality product.

Until that point, they can miss all the deadlines they want, I'm not paying for it.

But, as I was saying, they haven't even done THAT yet, either. Lots of people bought 4th ed specifically so they could play with distant buddies around the country (world?), only to find out AFTER they dropped cash on the rulebooks that they could not, in fact, do what was promised.

Uhhh they announced the Game Table wasn't going to be up before the rules books went on sale.

In either case DDI is a seperate product from 4e.

They only found this out after the fact, and could find out what was going on not by going to the D&Di site (nothing mentioned there about unavailable content) or the D&D main page (not there either), but buried in a post on the message boards.

Yeah WOTC has lousy communication tactics. But again, did you pay for DDI and not receive it?

You can be flippant and put on a happy face, that's great for you. But lots of folks are unhappy at what appears on it's face as an intentional misleading of their customers in order not to impact release-weekend sales (at worse) or rampant incompetance (at best). They have every right to be upset about it.

Great, if you want to be unhappy go for it!

I have other things to spend my time on personally.

 

[Twowolves]

Uhhh they announced the Game Table wasn't going to be up before the rules books went on sale.

Ok, first off, they "announced" it in a podcast and ampersand article. They didn't exactly, oh, I dunno, put it on their front webpage or anything. Or even on the D&Di page. Or recall all the fliers and promotional materials that claimed otherwise. Or even really, you know, TELL anyone in a fashion that implied that they wanted everyone to know. Secondly, they said the tabletop wouldn't be up, but outright said the compendium and PDFs of rulebooks WOULD be. None of which is accurate.

In either case DDI is a seperate product from 4e.

Not if you believe their advertising (there's a link in the 4th ed PHB) or everything they've said about 4th ed for a year. They have hyped the "integral" part of the D&Di, and how it meshes face to face and online gaming.

Yeah WOTC has lousy communication tactics. But again, did you pay for DDI and not receive it?

Not the point. If I have been waiting for the big summer blockbuster movie for over a year, and expect it to open on friday, July 4th, and I tell all my friends and change my plans and we all go to the theater (which boldly displays the movie's showtimes on their website and on the front of the building), get our soda and popcorn, only then to be told by the staff "sorry, the movie isn't ready yet. It'll be done when it's done. But you can watch some previews and 'making of' clips and give us feedback if you want", you can bet there'd be some unhappy campers, even if the popcorn is really good and the soda is very tasty.


But at least we can agree that their communication sucks. Which in the age of the internet, with a few hardcore message board fansites (and email for those who are members of their own message boards), there really is no excuse. The "Send All" button could have been their savior.

 

[Kesh]

Monday was a new Ampersand column... Can't say I was super haoppy with it, though, as I don't see why we need 2 editorials? But shrug. That's just personal prefference.

Two magazines (Dragon/Dungeon).

 

[Charwoman Gene]

Or did you mean they learned their lesson about trying to do software development in house?

Umm. Etools was outsourced. Learn to actually understand what you attack. Makes you look darn silly otherwise.

 

[WhatGravitas]

Patience. The lost virtue.

Yeah. And honestly, I'd rather see them pouring all efforts into the release of the GSL, including their webteam to make the announcement page, FAQ, SRD, and all that stuff that has to be put online.

Because GSL > Dragon/Dungeon.

Cheers, LT.

 

[Scribble]

Two magazines (Dragon/Dungeon).

well 3 editorials then.

one for each magazine + ampersand.

 

[Scribble]

Ok, first off, they "announced" it in a podcast and ampersand article. They didn't exactly, oh, I dunno, put it on their front webpage or anything. Or even on the D&Di page. Or recall all the fliers and promotional materials that claimed otherwise. Or even really, you know, TELL anyone in a fashion that implied that they wanted everyone to know. Secondly, they said the tabletop wouldn't be up, but outright said the compendium and PDFs of rulebooks WOULD be. None of which is accurate.

The compendium was up actually... It went down though, I don't know why? I was playing with it, maybe I broke it. Blame me if you want.

yeah their communications sucks. I'd be pissed to if I paid for the service.

Not if you believe their advertising (there's a link in the 4th ed PHB) or everything they've said about 4th ed for a year. They have hyped the "integral" part of the D&Di, and how it meshes face to face and online gaming.

They never said integral. They said just the opposite. They said you can still play D&D just as you always have. DDI just adds to it in a big way.

Not the point. If I have been waiting for the big summer blockbuster movie for over a year, and expect it to open on friday, July 4th, and I tell all my friends and change my plans and we all go to the theater (which boldly displays the movie's showtimes on their website and on the front of the building), get our soda and popcorn, only then to be told by the staff "sorry, the movie isn't ready yet. It'll be done when it's done. But you can watch some previews and 'making of' clips and give us feedback if you want", you can bet there'd be some unhappy campers, even if the popcorn is really good and the soda is very tasty.

The big summer blockbuster was 4e. That came out.

DDI is the making of movie that was suppsoed to be out at the same time that you could buy tickets to while at the big block buster if you wanted to.

If WOTC wants to sell me something, then they should give me a product I want to buy. If they don't put a product for me to buy on the shlf, I'm not goinjg to be mad. Why would I spend my time being mad? They just lose my business. That's THEIR problem, not mine.

But at least we can agree that their communication sucks. Which in the age of the internet, with a few hardcore message board fansites (and email for those who are members of their own message boards), there really is no excuse. The "Send All" button could have been their savior.

Yeah their communication tactics suck. Then again I don't think I've ever seen a business that I felt communicated effectively.

 

[Twowolves]

Umm. Etools was outsourced. Learn to actually understand what you attack. Makes you look darn silly otherwise.

Sorry, my age is showing. MasterTools was in my 3.0 PHB. eTools was what was finally released by CMP years after MasterTools cirlced the bowl for the last time. Not sure if Fluid had MT in their hands from day one, but my recollection is they did not.

According to my Yahoo-fu, Fluid and WotC didn't team up until March 2001.
Press Release

Another link

They apparantly decided to change the name 14 months later:
Yet another press release

In any case, the Magic Online v3.0 debacle illustrates the same point. When WotC does software development in-house, it comes in late (if ever) and doesn't live up to it's hype.

But hey, thanks for the personal jab, it totally makes everything I've said so far invalid. *roll*

 

[Twowolves]

The big summer blockbuster was 4e. That came out.

DDI is the making of movie that was suppsoed to be out at the same time that you could buy tickets to while at the big block buster if you wanted to.

Ok, how about 4th ed was the movie, but the D&Di was the 3-D glasses they were supposed to have to get the "full effect".

And don't get me wrong, I'm not mad. I just see how a lot of people are. I have in fact wasted more time in this thread than I have actively being mad (well, about this subject, anyway).

 

[Kristian Serrano]

Sorry, my age is showing. MasterTools was in my 3.0 PHB. eTools was what was finally released by CMP years after MasterTools cirlced the bowl for the last time. Not sure if Fluid had MT in their hands from day one, but my recollection is they did not.

According to my Yahoo-fu, Fluid and WotC didn't team up until March 2001.
Press Release

Another link

They apparantly decided to change the name 14 months later:
Yet another press release

In any case, the Magic Online v3.0 debacle illustrates the same point. When WotC does software development in-house, it comes in late (if ever) and doesn't live up to it's hype.

But hey, thanks for the personal jab, it totally makes everything I've said so far invalid. *roll*

You've got this all wrong. MasterTools, including the character generator in the 3.0 PHB was always outsourced by Fluid. Fluid scrapped MasterTools and released E-Tools. E-Tools was crap, and the relationship between Fluid and WotC ended. Months later, CMP and WotC made an arrangement in which CMP would fix the bugs in exchange for a license to publish WotC data sets for E-Tools and PCGen.

Google Fluid Entertainment, and you'll find a copy of the 3.0 PHB Character Generator.