Writers strike is a go

[Storm Raven]

Acting like Hollywood Writers, who earn an average income far above almost anyone on this board, are the poor oppressed folks always getting screwed by The Man, isn't very persuasive.

Nice shilling. I'm sure your corporate masters are pleased.

And I don't remember saying that the writers were "little guys" (except, in relative terms, they are). If you are getting $100,000, but the people you work for are screwing you out of $200,000, you are still being screwed. The fact that the studios want to screw the writers on a regular basis is not excused by how little or how much the writers make to begin with.

 

[Storm Raven]

Third, as for reality show writers, it's an incredibly complex issue. I'll try to sum it up simply: the people who write reality shows almost always also produce them, and direct them, and edit them, and even act in them sometimes! They cannot really join one union without having a conflict of interest, since they do the work of all the unions, and cannot with confidence state at any given time what percentage of work will fall where. It's totally chaotic, and on the fly. They decide as things happen if someone needs to become an editor that hour, or write something, or direct a scene, for film a scene, or mike a scene, or walk by the background of a scene, or do the work of a producer. WGA knows this. They know that the way the contracts work for reality show employees they could never actually gain the benefits of a writing contract because they would never have the "primary" role of writer. But, they would still have to pay dues.

Of course, the fact that every time reality show writers try to join the WGA, the studios fight them tooth and nail at the NLRB and then fire all those seeking to join the union at the earliest possible opportunity pretty much shows this claim to be the total lie that it is.

 

[Mistwell]

Most unions place, as a high priority, getting their members health insurance. In many ways, unions are a way of increasing the number of employers who offer health insurance. In the case of the WGA, those who are members of the union are entitled to health insurance, while the reality show and animation writers are the ones who usually don't get it as a benefit of their employment. (And the uninsured issue, while an issue, is somewhat overblown - about 85% of U.S. residents have health insurance, which means most employers are still providing it).

WOAH there.

You have not read the union agreements apparently.

For most Hollywood unions, you do NOT get any actual benefits unless you are employed FULL TIME in that field, AND you make a lot of money at it.

Your average part time writer, or director, or producer, ends up paying dues and not getting benefits (they are Associate members, not full members). Only those full time people, who are making the $200K average per year, are the ones getting the benefits. For the WGA, less than half of it's members belong to their health care plan.

And just to show how in-house this fight was, the health care and pension plan the WGA uses is the same one the Producers use. It's jointly run by WGA and AMPTP.

And IATSE by the way, who covers animation writers, has essentially the same kinds of clauses.

As the husband of a SAG actor, and a lawyer who has director and producer and writer clients, let me assure you that your perception of these unions and organizations that protect the little guy in that industry with benefits like health care is not really accurate. It's only the already successful full time people who get those benefits. In my opinion, and the opinion of an awful lot of rank and file members, the little guy gets screwed by those unions, stuck being forced to join, and forced to pay dues, but without the benefits that the full time workers get.

 

[Storm Raven]

WOAH there.

You have not read the union agreements apparently.

Woah there. You apparently didn't read the post I was responding to, because if you did, you'd know how silly the little diatribe you just made really is.

 

[Mistwell]

Nice shilling. I'm sure your corporate masters are pleased.

I have no corporate masters. In fact, though I don't represent a lot of clients these days, when I do it's individual writers, producers, directors, and actors. I have never represented a corporation in the entertainment industry.

But thanks for that totally unfounded personal attack! Always nice to know what kind of guy your talking to.

 

[Storm Raven]

I have no corporate masters. In fact, though I don't represent a lot of clients these days, when I do it's individual writers, producers, directors, and actors. I have never represented a corporation in the entertainment industry.

You sure do a great job impersonating a corporate shill online.

 

[Mistwell]

Of course, the fact that every time reality show writers try to join the WGA, the studios fight them tooth and nail at the NLRB and then fire all those seeking to join the union at the earliest possible opportunity pretty much shows this claim to be the total lie that it is.

I disagree.

They can, and do, join the WGA. It would be a ULP to fire someone for joining, easily proved, with build in heavy damages.

So, if you are going to call my claim a lie, the burden is on you to prove it. NLRB cases are public. Provide links to what you just claimed to have knowledge of. Let's see it.

 

[Storm Raven]

I disagree.

They can, and do, join the WGA. It would be a ULP to fire someone for joining, easily proved, with build in heavy damages.

So, if you are going to call my claim a lie, the burden is on you to prove it. NLRB cases are public. Provide links to what you just claimed to have knowledge of. Let's see it.

This is not too hard. Writers for America's Top Model voted to join the WGA. They were fired for their trouble.

http://defamer.com/hollywood/top/hollywood-protestwatch-writers-vs-top-models-189137.php
http://www.usatoday.com/life/television/news/2006-08-10-reality-tv-strike_x.htm

On November 6, 2006, WGAw filed unfair labor practice charges with the National Labor Relations Board after Top Model producers said the next season of the show will be produced using a new system that would not require writers. President Patric Verrone said: "..as they demanded union representation, the company decided they were expendable. This is illegal strikebreaking...."

http://www.broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6389164.html?display=Breaking+News&referral=SUPP&nid=2228

 

[Mistwell]

Woah there. You apparently didn't read the post I was responding to, because if you did, you'd know how silly the little diatribe you just made really is.

You brought up the issue of health care benefits and unions, relative to THIS discussion. I brought up the fact that the unions involved in THIS discussion don't give the benefits you are talking about. And you don't think that is relevant to this discussion?

 

[Mistwell]

This is not too hard. Writers for America's Top Model voted to join the WGA. They were fired for their trouble.

http://defamer.com/hollywood/top/hollywood-protestwatch-writers-vs-top-models-189137.php
http://www.usatoday.com/life/television/news/2006-08-10-reality-tv-strike_x.htm



http://www.broadcastingcable.com/article/CA6389164.html?display=Breaking+News&referral=SUPP&nid=2228

In my opinion, you just proved my point.

I said it would be a ULP to do so. You just quoted the ULP claim. If it went down the way the union says, they will win and the Producers will pay buckets in penalties (hence the "illegal to do that" part). If it didn't go down the way the union claims, then their allegation was false. Any way you look at it, THAT is the ULP I was talking about! It's illegal to fire someone for attempting to join a union, and if you do fire someone for doing it you get an Unfair Labor Practices claim slapped on you for breaking the law. Much like it's illegal to steal something and if you do steal something you get a theft charge slapped on you for breaking the law.