Yeah that's right, I killed a DRAGON single handed

[redwing]

No this isn't another anecdote about a huge victory from a previous character of mine. This thread was inspired from the thread dealing with Malhavoc's Iron Lore release. There was mention of a dragon being slayed in an open field by a sinlge warrior.

Does anyone remember the previews to Reign of Fire? The one where Matt McConhey (sp) is jumping toward the dragon with axe ready and the dragon is flying toward him? Well i thought that the movie was going to rock after seeing that. In the end, the scene took a whole 5 seconds. The dragon swallowed him whole. Where's the Heroism in that? Yeah I know, he sacrificed his own life, blah, blah, blah.

Other great dragon battles I can recall are: Smaug, the one in Beowulf.

The Point (and BADD will agree with me): Dragons aren't supposed to be defeated everyday. They are special and should be made out to be special. They should be EPIC. I ran a game the other day where a dragon was terrorizing a country, and hopefully the PC's would leave it be for later levels and give me some time to throw in some story with it. What do they do? Just because I mention dragon, they run off to fight it. TPK.

don't get me wrong, I love the idea of a mythical battle of one-on-one, man vs. dragon. But it's got to be right, its got to be epic.

How do you all feel about battling dragons? What sort of tactics do you feel would be necessary for a one-on-one fight with a dragon (may not be included in the current rules). How could you put that epic feeling back into the man vs. dragon fight?

 

[Evilhalfling]

This is a fun idea.

I think you are looking for a single character built to take on dragons. There was one in a dungeon issue - 118. Prolly what 3 levels over the dragon CR and decked out with lots of magic. 35 pt buy, magic at suggested cash value.

Say a battle with the adult green listed in the MM. CR 13

hmm a fighter would need to be an archer, start him with 2 levels of Monk for evasion and saving throws Monk 2/Fighter 14, I think he has a good chance.

 

[Jdvn1]

Um... I've done that before. A very lucky Psion/Soulknife I played with a broken power in a 3.0 game. Same game I killed a Balor single-handed too.

That was a cool character, but his rolls were lucky.

 

[Mystery Man]

I'm purposefully letting my players fight dragons that are below their party level. The fights are usually over in a few rounds. This way they'll be nice and overconfident, cocksure if you will for when I whip out the big sum-b.

 

[DaveMage]

don't get me wrong, I love the idea of a mythical battle of one-on-one, man vs. dragon. But it's got to be right, its got to be epic.

It's got to be epic? What if it's a white dragon wyrmling?


My point is that, no, it doesn't have to be epic. It just has to be fun.

 

[Lancelot]

Dragons are fairly rare in my campaign, in part to try and keep some of their 'mystique'. However, when they do show up, they tend to be pretty lethal for their CR. Requires some serious party cooperation.

For example... A few months ago, the party fighter decided to take on a good-sized red dragon all by his lonesome, in the style of Beowulf. The fighter has a somewhat specialized (munchkin) build: one level of Monk, the rest in Sumarai and Iaijustsu Master. At 15th level, he was running AC 40+ (in no armor) and had a collosal Reflex save, with Evasion, to completely negate dragon breath. Not much damage capability per hit, but fast speed and Spring Attack to limit the dragon's ability to get a full attack on him.

Despite that, all the dragon had to do was tag him once and succeed on a grapple check - it had a feat giving it Improved Grab. The fighter lacked a 'Freedom of Movement' effect, was easily pinned, and got ground into the... uhh... ground. WotC's Dragonomicon is a great source for springing that kind of surprise on your players.

The party cleric and the secondary fighter showed up soon after, but lacked the ACs and Reflex saves to handle the situation. They were steadily getting fried to a crisp (Lingering Breath meant multiple rounds of damage from a single blast) when the *real* hero showed up...

The party mage. I'm not sure about the experiences of other DMs, but my group's wizard uses a fairly standard build (and equipment roughly in line with the wealth-by-level guidelines)... and he's simply lethal to dragons. The various energy protection spells deal with breath weapons, and Stoneskin/Blink/quickened Dimension Door can all limit physical damage. The wizard's prefered tactic involves various Force effects: Walls of Force, Bigby's hand spells (which often have higher grapple rolls than even the beefiest party fighter), etc. He limits the dragon's ability to maneuver, then pummels it to death with Scorching Rays (usually Empowered, and usually turned into sonic rays with the Energy Substitution feat).

Ways around it, of course: Anti-Magic Field, Spell-Turning, etc... but you can only use so many of those without it becoming obvious you're trying to single out the wizard.

I guess bottom line for me is that I've never seen the necessity to "put that epic feeling" back into the 1 PC vs 1 Dragon fight... because they tend to be pretty lethal encounters at the best of times. I'd consider it nearly unthinkable to take one on alone. However, if you're having the same sort of troubles I've had with the wizard above, the Dragonomicon is a great place to start. Some of the feats and draconic magic items included there are just nasty.

Also, don't forgert that dragons can be bad news when they use "non-standard" tactics like trips, grapples (...into the air, then dropping the PC from a great height), bullrushes, knocking over buildings on top of characters, igniting the forest they're fighting in to deal continual fire damage, etc. The latter tactics are particular useful in that the massive collateral damage can give the whole scene a really cinematic feel. ("Whoa... you mean the whole village is alight, and he just smashed the town hall's roof in?")

 

[RandomPrecision]

Smaug, the one in Beowulf.

Smaug's in The Hobbit. I don't remember the name of the one in Beowulf, but I do remember that the dragon killed Beowulf, so you might not want to have a battle like that one.

 

[Fieari]

Wyrmling encounters can be just as epic as any other dragon. My players have learned to hate wyrmlings with a passion. Tight corridors plus good flight skills plus 150' movement rate plus fly by attack means that they'll need readied actions just to be able to do anything to the little bugger, and who ever said it had to attack the party all the time? They can pull a kobold and make traps, manipulate the battlefield and generally make life miserable for the party. Plus, if they get their hands on a magical item or two, they can be dangerous indeed.

It's all about how you play it. How you play it.

 

[Allandaros]

As for making the battle feel epic, I would suggest:

a) Having the dragon THINK. Don't just get into a flame-claw-claw-claw-bite-tailslash!-flame routine. A dragon should be played with as much personality as a major NPC. Hell, it IS a major NPC.
b) Have the dragon talk. Taunting the foe in epic middle-english sounding phrases always goes over well.
c) An ideal one-on-one dragon fight, for me, should offer a warrior or thief hero the opportunity to leap upon the dragon's neck and stab it there once or twice. This sounds trivial, but to me at least, it will really help to build up the cinematic tension of the scene.
d) Um. More stuff later.

BTW, Redwing - you voluntarily saw Reign of Fire? For God's sake, man, WHY?!?!?!?!???

 

[Voadam]

My 15th level eldritch knight fought one in his solo game and it was a lot of fun. It was only an advanced dragon turtle with more than a 200 hit points, but it was my first dragon FIGHT since playing 3e, although the third dragon he came across. Flight, ranged spells, defensive spells, and summoning a huge water elemental were the key to that battle. If he had gotten me in his jaws it would have been all over.